Why CQ is the best coach we have ever had, or ever will have

[rugs]

But players are more important than the manager. You put Ali Daei as head coach of Germany im sure he would still be able to do good things. Where as you put Jose Mourinho as coach of Palestine I dont think he would be able to do anything.

No one said they weren't.

I am saying players aren't the only variable and you can't easily dismiss everything else.

If that were the case then Italy and Spain should have done much better because they were stacked with great players and Costa Rica should have never made it out of the group stages because they have a few talented players.

Managers, tactics, training, game plan, discipline, team spirit, etc.... all matter.

[Z Joon]

thats not a very rational expectation considering Iran hasent made the final since 1976. Most of our players play in second division european teams or arab teams. A semi final expectation could be reasonable because of the path given but expecting at a minimum the final is a little far fetched.

Most of these players played in top leagues not so long ago, and Iranian league based players are better players than all asian players except those from SK, Australia and Japan. Besides, we have beaten a SK team full of euro league players consecutively with an IPL based team with few 2nd division players and a Standard Liege (bench) striker. Making the final is a perfectly realistic goal, we won't get a better draw than that for long. We are speaking about the Asian cup, not the WC, Al-Arabi Dejagah, Esteghlal's Teymourian, Al Ahli's Hosseini ect.. stay on another level than all the participating countries of the cup, except Japan and South Korea.

And what do you have to say about Iraq winning the Asian cup in 2007 with 2nd tier Arab league players and few IPL players?

[ali alipour]

Most of these players played in top leagues not so long ago, and Iranian league based players are better players than all asian players except those from SK, Australia and Japan. Besides, we have beaten a SK team full of euro league players consecutively with an IPL based team with few 2nd division players and a Standard Liege (bench) striker. Making the final is a perfectly realistic goal, we won't get a better draw than that for long. We are speaking about the Asian cup, not the WC, Al-Arabi Dejagah, Esteghlal's Teymourian, Al Ahli's Hosseini ect.. stay on another level than all the participating countries of the cup, except Japan and South Korea.

And what do you have to say about Iraq winning the Asian cup in 2007 with 2nd tier Arab league players and few IPL players?

ipl players are clearly not better than all asian players besides those listed other wise ipl teams would not have done so poorly in the acl in past years (i dont count esteghlal because most of those players arent playing in the ipl anymore).
Iraq was clearly a fluke like greece winning euro. Otherwise youd think the asian champion would have been able to make the 2010 wcq last round, go farther then qf in 2011 ac, and make wc 2014

[Z Joon]

ipl players are clearly not better than all asian players besides those listed other wise ipl teams would not have done so poorly in the acl in past years (i dont count esteghlal because most of those players arent playing in the ipl anymore).
Iraq was clearly a fluke like greece winning euro. Otherwise youd think the asian champion would have been able to make the 2010 wcq last round, go farther then qf in 2011 ac, and make wc 2014

Not a good reasoning. I am comparing Iranian players of the IPL and other ASIAN players of Asian leagues. Iranian players from the IPL are better than Qatari players of QSL, Emirati players of UAE league ect... Don't list ACL results as an argument when you don't understand my point.
You must maybe feel like a genius when saying that Lucho Gonzalez of Al Rayyan and Raul and Rodrigo Tabata of Al Sadd are better than Iranian IPL players but that's not my point.

[ali alipour]

Not a good reasoning. I am comparing Iranian players of the IPL and other ASIAN players of Asian leagues. Iranian players from the IPL are better than Qatari players of QSL, Emirati players of UAE league ect... Don't list ACL results as an argument when you don't understand my point.
You must maybe feel like a genius when saying that Lucho Gonzalez of Al Rayyan and Raul and Rodrigo Tabata of Al Sadd are better than Iranian IPL players but that's not my point.

what is your reasoning that iranian players from ipl are better than uae players from uae or saudi from saudi

[Z Joon]

what is your reasoning that iranian players from ipl are better than uae players from uae or saudi from saudi

We have beaten these national teams countless times with complete domestic teams. We have qualified to the World Cup with an IPL based team and they have not.


what is your reasoning that Saudi and uae players are better than iranian players from the IPL

[rugs]

Re: Why CQ is the best coach we have ever had, or ever will have

ipl players are clearly not better than all asian players besides those listed other wise ipl teams would not have done so poorly in the acl in past years (i dont count esteghlal because most of those players arent playing in the ipl anymore).
Iraq was clearly a fluke like greece winning euro. Otherwise youd think the asian champion would have been able to make the 2010 wcq last round, go farther then qf in 2011 ac, and make wc 2014

Actually Zob Ahan making it to the ACL final is another great example of a manager finding success with mostly average players.

Ebrahimzadeh was terrific with that squad.

[ali alipour]

We have beaten these national teams countless times with complete domestic teams. We have qualified to the World Cup with an IPL based team and they have not.
what is your reasoning that Saudi and uae players are better than iranian players from the IPL

you are probably right i misread your original statement. Nonetheless i think with the regression of the ipl has lessened this gap and continues to lessen so ipl players and qatari, uae players are not that far off. If iran is to make the final they need to rely on european based players and arab based players that have recent european experience, and of course queiroz.

[Z Joon]

you are probably right i misread your original statement. Nonetheless i think with the regression of the ipl this gap has lessened and continues to lessen so ipl players and qatari, uae players are not that far off. If iran is to make the final they need to rely on european based players and arab based players that have recent european experience, and of course queiroz.

Maybe that gap is decreasing, but the point is that the IPL players regularly playing for TM are on a whole other level than most of the Asian teams. I don't think any team has stronger players than Hajsafi, Teymourian, Rafiei, Seyed Jalal, Sadeghi, Pouladi, Heydari ect... except the countries I previously listed. We should be able to make at least the semis and aim to be in the final with our squad and coach on paper.

[Abtin]

You gotta give credit where it's due. Zandi knows what he's talking about!

[ali alipour]

Maybe that gap is decreasing, but the point is that the IPL players regularly playing for TM are on a whole other level than most of the Asian teams. I don't think any team has stronger players than Hajsafi, Teymourian, Rafiei, Seyed Jalal, Sadeghi, Pouladi, Heydari ect... except the countries I previously listed. We should be able to make at least the semis and aim to be in the final with our squad and coach on paper.

actually i change my mind i disagree with you. Iran has had a lot of trouble consistently beating teams like saudi, uae, qatar, bahrain and has no where near " consistently" beat them. Over the past 4 meetings we have 3 ties with qatar and one win. We beat bahrain 6-0 but then tied them 1-1. We were the only team in 2010 wcq to not beat uae and as you know saudi beat us in azadi. So i dont think you have any proof to show that ipl based tm players are any better than uae saudi or qatari players. We made the world cup over them because our 1 win against qatar was at the most needed time. We also didnt make wc2010 because we lost points to uae and saudi.

[Z Joon]

Why CQ is the best coach we have ever had, or ever will have

actually i change my mind i disagree with you. Iran has had a lot of trouble consistently beating teams like saudi, uae, qatar, bahrain and has no where near " consistently" beat them. Over the past 4 meetings we have 3 ties with qatar and one win. We beat bahrain 6-0 but then tied them 1-1. We were the only team in 2010 wcq to not beat uae and as you know saudi beat us in azadi. So i dont think you have any proof to show that ipl based tm players are any better than uae saudi or qatari players. We made the world cup over them because our 1 win against qatar was at the most needed time. We also didnt make wc2010 because we lost points to uae and saudi.

I made my point. Read again and think about it long enough. Listing few matches here and there won't help you.

"We made the world cup over them because our 1 win against qatar was at the most needed time." = We made the world cup over them. That's all you need to say. The "because" "if this" "if that" are useless, we made it, not them. I can give you the "because" and "if this" and "if that" to explain the reason why we didn't qualify in 2010 as well. It works both ways my friend.

Let me try to imitate you:

South Korea's full legionnaire team dropped points to Lebanon last year, so South Korea has no proof that their legionnaires are better than the Lebanese league players
South Korea's full legionnaire team dropped points to Kuwait in 2011 during the WCQ, so South Korea has no proof that their legionnaires are better than the Kuwaiti league players
South Korea's full legionnaire team dropped points to Uzbekistan in 2012 during the WCQ when they tied them 2-2, so South Korea has no proof that their legionnaires are better than the Uzbek league players
Japan dropped points to Uzbekistan during the WCQ when they tied them 1-1 and then lost to them home 0-1 in 2012, they have no proof than their legionnaires are better than the Uzbek league players
Japan lost to North Korea in 2011 during the WCQ when they lost 1-0, they have no proof than their legionnaires are better than the North Korean league players
Australia lost to Oman in 2011 during the WCQ when they lost 1-0, they have no proof than their legionnaires are better than the Omani league players
Australia dropped points to Oman in 2012 during the WCQ when they tied 0-0, they have no proof than their legionnaires are better than the Omani league players
Australia dropped points to Oman in 2013 during the WCQ when they tied 2-2, they have no proof than their legionnaires are better than the Omani league players


Now the question is, do you want me to continue? Because I am not done, so before you want me to waste my time and continue you might have possibly already understood the level of intelligence in your reply.

[ali alipour]

I am not talking about 1 game iran consistently doesnt beat these arab teams. As i said before last 4 games vs qatar only one win, last 4 against uae 2 wins, and last 2 vs saudi 0 wins. And this only the last few years that i can remember.

[Ando Teymourian]

Adding to the list of player's praising CQ, another is Farhad Majidi. He mentioned it on Navad briefly (Adel cut him off pretty fast), but he said the big reason he accepted the TM call up in 2013 was because of CQ was coach.

IMO, the player's opinion of a coach is more valuable than fans who have no pro football experience.

[Camran khan]

So.. Haven't we discussed this 100 times? 99% of the board agrees with you. btw, talking about the Asian cup, I believe we can win it, and expect to reach the final etc, but if we're knocked out in the semis or the quarters, facing a strong team like South Korea, and having a shit ton of bad luck, then I won't be cheering for him to be sacked either. But if we perform badly, and lose, then I'm not sure. But even if he does poorly, we will still do poorly at the next asian cup with another coach, so I'm not sure I want him gone unless we don't advance from our group or are eliminated by Iraq or something..