Ghotbi - Able coach or Smart Individual

[zzgloo]

Bahram , you have obviously lost your temper while writing the above answer, and with it you lost your compsoure and balancer. Once again you burst with anger and come up with a lot of false arguments and emotional outcry.

I know Human very well, he is a good friend and I also know that he is much more qualified than Ghotbi will ever be , if qualification means classes, FIFA & AFC licenses.

Human's English is as good as Ghotbi and so is his skills in computers. Human has his own website and has some useful tools for his profession. The difference is that Human acquired all this skill in his home land called "Iran" and never had the luxury of growing up or being send to the west to learn his skills.

The only thing that Human lacks is "Party Bazi" . He does not earn enough money to pay under the table , nor does he have enough clout around the corridors of power.

So , before you insult someone like this because he does not fit your profile , or said something that you did not like , I think it is prudent to know about the person and do not create false stories like Branko used him because of his English....... I guess Daei used him because of his Persian !

Majid Jaan.....
You are right...I may have lost a little composure..........
Mr.Ghotbi,is the head coach of the Iranian National team,we call TM...........
Is that true ?.....
if so, Mr.Afazelis statements regarding him not being qualified ,should be taken just as criticisms toward Mr.Daei were taken after equal among of time and chance,Mr.Daei& Mr.Afazeli were given !!!
Why Mr.Afazeli, does not say, we should give Mr.Ghotbi a fair chance ?
Why does he not appologize for his own failier ?
Why does n,t he say, The fault was not all Ali daei,s ,and he also made many mistakes ?
..................................................
....his case, is just another ,pointing fingures at every one but ourseleves !....which is very much Domestic system,Ghotbi is trying to avoid !,and teach a new culture in Iranian Football......
I will assure you, Ghotbi will not confront Mr .Afazeli..as his ststements are nothing new !........
Ghotbi,Aready thanked Daei for his work.....and Afazeli should find another way,to find himself a job !
With a good number of domestic coaches available...., I see absolutly no chance,any domestic team would give to Mr.Afazeli............He may very well stay unemployed indefenetly !........
............................
Mjid Jaan, I ,....like you,..admire hard work, and self made men........., but to put down others to serve self, is a cheap way to advance.

[maij]

Bahram , you have obviously lost your temper while writing the above answer, and with it you lost your compsoure and balancer. Once again you burst with anger and come up with a lot of false arguments and emotional outcry.

I know Human very well, he is a good friend and I also know that he is much more qualified than Ghotbi will ever be , if qualification means classes, FIFA & AFC licenses.

Human's English is as good as Ghotbi and so is his skills in computers. Human has his own website and has some useful tools for his profession. The difference is that Human acquired all this skill in his home land called "Iran" and never had the luxury of growing up or being send to the west to learn his skills.

The only thing that Human lacks is "Party Bazi" . He does not earn enough money to pay under the table , nor does he have enough clout around the corridors of power.

So , before you insult someone like this because he does not fit your profile , or said something that you did not like , I think it is prudent to know about the person and do not create false stories like Branko used him because of his English....... I guess Daei used him because of his Persian !

[zzgloo]

I had higher expectation and definitly a different language from someone with the abilities of Mr. Afazeli. He is justified to express his opinion, but befarma, beshin va betemarg all mean the same. I am dissapointed the way he expressed himself. But nevertheles he is entitled to his opinion.

Ali jaan, what do you mean by " The abilities of mr.Afazeli " ?.....
What abilities ?
Mr.Afazeli,is comapairing,Ghotbi's work,in a very short time, with a mess daei had put TM in, with a year and a half daei was given, with all the support,and all the time he needed.....
Where was Mr.afazeli, when we tied in UAE, and TM had only one win,during his year and a half ?
Mr.Afazeli,misses,how better TM's chamistry was in the last three games...with a little time Mr.Ghotbi had....
...................
Just because he reads English, does not mean he has abilities !
just because he is friends with Webmaster,and is a connection for PFDC,does not mean he has abilities.
just because,Ali daei,and Branko used him, for his English-farsi language translations,does not mean he has abilities.
....................
The Guy is just ,a Bad Loser........
calling Daei the greatest football personality...and equaiting On the field abilities with Coaching abilities.......
he is just pissed off getting fired, thats all.....and he knows, he is not going to get any coaching job in Iran.......as his English language knowledge would not help in domestic league......
.......................
Our Mods,whom have always had the possition, " Supporting the head coach of TM ", should not stop ,...and critisize Human Afazeli just as hard.....
........................
If Ghotbi is a " Jiaan ", Mr.Afazeli and his " Know it all,arrogant,people insulting,players insulting,etc,etc Ali daei ", are : " Doroshkeh ", .
How could they blaim others for the mess they put us all in ?
"" Roo ke Roo nist,sange paye Ghazvine """ !!

[maij]

I had higher expectation and definitly a different language from someone with the abilities of Mr. Afazeli. He is justified to express his opinion, but befarma, beshin va betemarg all mean the same. I am dissapointed the way he expressed himself. But nevertheles he is entitled to his opinion.

Ali Agha , it is obvious that my Farsi will never be as good as yours , and I might have missed something significant in this article ..
So , what part of Human's comments you found disappointing ( I assume he was insulting someone !) ?

[BehzadB]

I had higher expectation and definitly a different language from someone with the abilities of Mr. Afazeli. He is justified to express his opinion, but befarma, beshin va betemarg all mean the same. I am dissapointed the way he expressed himself. But nevertheles he is entitled to his opinion.

Well, when someone like Hooman Afazeli doesn't watch his "Adabiat", what can we expect from fans.


I still have serious doubt about whether Hooman has said those things. Fart News Agency is known to be Garbage... but then again, Daie didn't have good Adabiat either..

[Ali Chicago]

فوتبال ايران ژيان را با قيمت بنز برگزيد

افاضلى: برنامه ۴ ساله قطبى، ايران را به بنگلادش مى رساند




هومن افاضلى دستيار سابق على دايى در تيم ملى گفت: قطبى با هنرنمايى خود، مى تواند بعد از ۴ سال، سطح فوتبال ايران را با بنگلادش يكى كند. وى اظهار داشت: ناكامى تيم ملى مى تواند دلايل متعددى داشته باشد. يكى از دلايل، ساختارى است كه در كوتاه مدت قابل حل كردن نيست. فردى هم وجود ندارد كه بخواهد با برنامه اى كه ارائه مى كند، آنها را حل كند.او ادامه داد: در تاريخ ۸۰ ساله جام جهانى، ايران فقط در ۳ دوره حضور داشته است. اين معنايش اين است كه اشكالات فراوانى داريم. هميشه خود به خود برخى بازيكن نخبه گرد هم جمع شده اند يا يك مربى برنامه ريز آمده و برخى مسائل فراهم بود، تيم به جام جهانى رفت؛ در غير اينصورت، در اين زمينه هيچ موقع موفق عمل نكرديم. آناليزور سابق تيم ملى با اشاره به اينكه با تعويض دايى مخالف بودم، گفت: از فرصت هاى مقطعى هم خوب استفاده نمى كنيم. دايى در اولين باختش در يك بازى رسمى بركنار شد و فدراسيون به دنبال قطبى رفت.

وى ادامه داد: قطبى در رديف بزرگترين هنرمندان مانند عزت الله انتظامى، جمشيد مشايخى و محمدعلى كشاورز و چه بسا بالاتر قرار دارد. قطبى مى تواند نامزد جايزه اسكار هم شود. اگر دايى بزرگترين شخصيت فوتبالى را از سمت سرمربيگرى بركنار مى كنيم، كسى كه همه دنيا فوتبال ايران را به اسم او مى شناسند، بايد دنبال كسى برويم كه يا در سطح دايى باشد يا بالاتر از او. افاضلى خاطر نشان ساخت: مقايسه بين تروسيه و قطبى مثل بنز و ژيان است كه ژيان را انتخاب كرديم. قطبى را با سلام و صلوات آورديم و پس از آن قول هايى داد كه هيچكدام عملى نشد. نه تيم به جام جهانى رفت و نه ۲ كره اى را كه مى گفت هيچ كس اندازه من نمى شناسد، شكست داديم. زمان قطبى ۳ مسابقه انجام داديم كه ۲ ديدار با تيم هايى بود كه تكليفشان از قبل مشخص شده و انگيزه اى براى ديدار با ما نداشتند. وى با بيان اينكه امارات در مسابقه با ايران از ۷ بازيكن جوانانش استفاده مى كرد، گفت: در تهران اين تيم را به زور با يك گل شكست داديم و مقابل كره شمالى مساوى كرديم و برابر كره جنوبى در حالى كه قطبى ادعا مى كرد، اين تيم را مانند كف دستش مى شناسد، شانس آورديم كه بازى را واگذار نكرديم. افاضلى در مورد ادعاى قطبى مبنى بر اينكه مربيان ايرانى همين ۵ امتياز را هم نمى گرفتند، تصريح كرد: او راست مى گويد زيرا مربيان ايرانى ۶ امتياز مى گرفتند. اگر با دايى بوديم، كره شمالى را شكست مى داديم و اگر با كره جنوبى مساوى مى كرديم، به راحتى به جام جهانى مى رفتيم. وى افزود: از لحاظ آمارى ثابت مى كنم كه كار قطبى با اشكال مواجه بود. تيم قطبى نسبت به دايى از لحاظ آمارى ضعيف تر بود. اگر آمار فنى را بررسى كنيم، مجموع توليدات فنى تيم ملى در اين ۳ بازى از ۳ مسابقه اى كه دايى مربى تيم ملى بود، در مجموع پايين تر بود. كمك دايى در تيم ملى ادامه داد: قطبى به خوبى نظم و انضباط را در تيم ملى رعايت كرد. اين نظم و انضباطى كه قطبى از آن حرف مى زند، شايد در هاليوود باشد چرا كه در تيم ملى اين را مشاهده نكرديم. چه زمانى سابقه داشته كه ۱۰ بازيكن همزمان از تيم ملى جدا شوند؟ هر كس يك جايش را بهانه كرد و رفت. وى در مورد موافقت فدراسيون با برنامه هاى ۴ ساله قطبى، اظهار داشت: بسيار خوشحالم كه اين اتفاق مى افتد چرا كه تا ۴ سال مى توان راجع به برنامه او حرف زد و لذت برد. ممكن است قول قهرمانى جهان را هم بدهد. قطبى حقش ضايع شده كه ۳ بار اسكار سينماى جهان را نگرفته است. افاضلى با اشاره به اينكه ضمانت مى دهم در پايان برنامه ۴ ساله قطبى فوتبال ايران در حد بنگلادش باشد، گفت: تنها جايى كه بين ژيان و بنز با قيمت بنز، ژيان را انتخاب مى كنند، ايران است.

I had higher expectation and definitly a different language from someone with the abilities of Mr. Afazeli. He is justified to express his opinion, but befarma, beshin va betemarg all mean the same. I am dissapointed the way he expressed himself. But nevertheles he is entitled to his opinion.

[zzgloo]

^ Do you really think so? I don't think it looks like change, it rather seems the hardliners are about to win.

The poleyical analyst of CIA, said : " The Jeanie is not out of the bottle yet,but the Cork has been permenantly removed ".

[Hadi]

both, he is able AND smart.

The South Korea match in south Korea and Iran's math in N.Korea, although very far from perfect, were better than all TMs performances in the past 2 years.

[maij]

فوتبال ايران ژيان را با قيمت بنز برگزيد

افاضلى: برنامه ۴ ساله قطبى، ايران را به بنگلادش مى رساند




هومن افاضلى دستيار سابق على دايى در تيم ملى گفت: قطبى با هنرنمايى خود، مى تواند بعد از ۴ سال، سطح فوتبال ايران را با بنگلادش يكى كند. وى اظهار داشت: ناكامى تيم ملى مى تواند دلايل متعددى داشته باشد. يكى از دلايل، ساختارى است كه در كوتاه مدت قابل حل كردن نيست. فردى هم وجود ندارد كه بخواهد با برنامه اى كه ارائه مى كند، آنها را حل كند.او ادامه داد: در تاريخ ۸۰ ساله جام جهانى، ايران فقط در ۳ دوره حضور داشته است. اين معنايش اين است كه اشكالات فراوانى داريم. هميشه خود به خود برخى بازيكن نخبه گرد هم جمع شده اند يا يك مربى برنامه ريز آمده و برخى مسائل فراهم بود، تيم به جام جهانى رفت؛ در غير اينصورت، در اين زمينه هيچ موقع موفق عمل نكرديم. آناليزور سابق تيم ملى با اشاره به اينكه با تعويض دايى مخالف بودم، گفت: از فرصت هاى مقطعى هم خوب استفاده نمى كنيم. دايى در اولين باختش در يك بازى رسمى بركنار شد و فدراسيون به دنبال قطبى رفت.

وى ادامه داد: قطبى در رديف بزرگترين هنرمندان مانند عزت الله انتظامى، جمشيد مشايخى و محمدعلى كشاورز و چه بسا بالاتر قرار دارد. قطبى مى تواند نامزد جايزه اسكار هم شود. اگر دايى بزرگترين شخصيت فوتبالى را از سمت سرمربيگرى بركنار مى كنيم، كسى كه همه دنيا فوتبال ايران را به اسم او مى شناسند، بايد دنبال كسى برويم كه يا در سطح دايى باشد يا بالاتر از او. افاضلى خاطر نشان ساخت: مقايسه بين تروسيه و قطبى مثل بنز و ژيان است كه ژيان را انتخاب كرديم. قطبى را با سلام و صلوات آورديم و پس از آن قول هايى داد كه هيچكدام عملى نشد. نه تيم به جام جهانى رفت و نه ۲ كره اى را كه مى گفت هيچ كس اندازه من نمى شناسد، شكست داديم. زمان قطبى ۳ مسابقه انجام داديم كه ۲ ديدار با تيم هايى بود كه تكليفشان از قبل مشخص شده و انگيزه اى براى ديدار با ما نداشتند. وى با بيان اينكه امارات در مسابقه با ايران از ۷ بازيكن جوانانش استفاده مى كرد، گفت: در تهران اين تيم را به زور با يك گل شكست داديم و مقابل كره شمالى مساوى كرديم و برابر كره جنوبى در حالى كه قطبى ادعا مى كرد، اين تيم را مانند كف دستش مى شناسد، شانس آورديم كه بازى را واگذار نكرديم. افاضلى در مورد ادعاى قطبى مبنى بر اينكه مربيان ايرانى همين ۵ امتياز را هم نمى گرفتند، تصريح كرد: او راست مى گويد زيرا مربيان ايرانى ۶ امتياز مى گرفتند. اگر با دايى بوديم، كره شمالى را شكست مى داديم و اگر با كره جنوبى مساوى مى كرديم، به راحتى به جام جهانى مى رفتيم. وى افزود: از لحاظ آمارى ثابت مى كنم كه كار قطبى با اشكال مواجه بود. تيم قطبى نسبت به دايى از لحاظ آمارى ضعيف تر بود. اگر آمار فنى را بررسى كنيم، مجموع توليدات فنى تيم ملى در اين ۳ بازى از ۳ مسابقه اى كه دايى مربى تيم ملى بود، در مجموع پايين تر بود. كمك دايى در تيم ملى ادامه داد: قطبى به خوبى نظم و انضباط را در تيم ملى رعايت كرد. اين نظم و انضباطى كه قطبى از آن حرف مى زند، شايد در هاليوود باشد چرا كه در تيم ملى اين را مشاهده نكرديم. چه زمانى سابقه داشته كه ۱۰ بازيكن همزمان از تيم ملى جدا شوند؟ هر كس يك جايش را بهانه كرد و رفت. وى در مورد موافقت فدراسيون با برنامه هاى ۴ ساله قطبى، اظهار داشت: بسيار خوشحالم كه اين اتفاق مى افتد چرا كه تا ۴ سال مى توان راجع به برنامه او حرف زد و لذت برد. ممكن است قول قهرمانى جهان را هم بدهد. قطبى حقش ضايع شده كه ۳ بار اسكار سينماى جهان را نگرفته است. افاضلى با اشاره به اينكه ضمانت مى دهم در پايان برنامه ۴ ساله قطبى فوتبال ايران در حد بنگلادش باشد، گفت: تنها جايى كه بين ژيان و بنز با قيمت بنز، ژيان را انتخاب مى كنند، ايران است.

[Dubxl152]

I cant sit here and judge Ghotbis coaching ability based on his short stint as TM coach and his 3.75 matchs the 2 friendlies are like 3/4 of a real game.

I think he has the ability to be a good coach but what any good coach needs is ample time with his players and quality infrastructure....(doesnt exist in Iran)

It doesnt matter who our coach is in the future even world class coachs like murhino or lippi would have a difficult time trying to get a team to
A. Buy into their program.
B. Play together as a unit per coachs new instructions
C. determine the best possible players and work on the complete lack of basic skills which were poor to begin with the majority of our players and have degraded even more since '06.

It takes more than a couple months to teach a player like Madanchi to dribble without looking down @ the ball. Masoud to take shots on the first shot or instill confidence in the players to shoot from outside the box. Now Ghotbis subs were idiotic and meaningless, he wasted all of his sub opportunities BUT i feel that the team played more organized under his leadership than under Daei's, and he didnt bring party bazi to the table.

Im not a fan of Daei as a coach or Ghotbi as a coach, im a fan of TM. So i dont care who the next coach is as long as he is qualified and is given ample time to work with the team. Considering whats going on in our country right now..... this should be the least of our worries.


PPS. It would be awsome if we could have a Politics or General Plus forum where we can discuss current events in IR, what we think the future holds etc in a polite civilized manner. I don't know if thats feasible with our current servers or how much of a chore it would be for kamran, Mansoor or the Mods. just a suggestion.

[Martin-Reza]

^ Do you really think so? I don't think it looks like change, it rather seems the hardliners are about to win.

[zzgloo]

There is probably no reason to discuss this anylonger, nor to waste time on IR football.

It seems they are banning several players, making trouble for our legionnaires, banning the most popular journalists and the best managers. That will surely lead everyone who is not a full Hezbollahi to quit, no chance Ghotbi would work under such circumstances.

So we will have a depleted team coached by MK and a Federation led by the dumbest of the dumb.

It's probably time to kiss TM and Iranian football good-bye and use our energy on something more useful. Maybe on making a stiff competition against those who are responsible for this?

It is the most exciting time......
I would have exchanged the WC trophy with the currant situation.....
we are getting our country back....and that is absolutly the greatest news.

[Martin-Reza]

There is probably no reason to discuss this anylonger, nor to waste time on IR football.

It seems they are banning several players, making trouble for our legionnaires, banning the most popular journalists and the best managers. That will surely lead everyone who is not a full Hezbollahi to quit, no chance Ghotbi would work under such circumstances.

So we will have a depleted team coached by MK and a Federation led by the dumbest of the dumb.

It's probably time to kiss TM and Iranian football good-bye and use our energy on something more useful. Maybe on making a stiff competition against those who are responsible for this?

[zzgloo]

These people keep doging all the real issues. Of course , I am not undermining the role of TM coach and beleive in the best , but fix your house first ........

Majid Jaan,.......
I ,like you , believe, we are on a same wave length....and Just differ on the conclusion........
To understand the core of your opinion which is the above statement by you.......,We both agree with understanding the problems...yet, your conclusion , is " We need to Fix our own house first "...which is where we differ.....................
We , in Iran, are not the only people who have problems......and while it is true, best foundementals would bring best results...( as top economic power houses are Football power houses as well ), yet.......
I believe, we must do with what we have at hand !...we must go,with the reality, and learn to adapt !....as it is the ever going challenge, and we must accept,and do our best at any given time.
The fact ,that every 4 years, we have different set of represetetives from AFRICA, means, they like us ,have domestic Obsticles,and challanges !
The Nigerians,can not say, we will stop trying untill we would have all our house in order......they compete every time, as they should, and as we should.....and every time, we, like them, do our best,with the situations at hand.
As I said,long before,on this forum.......our football, is like our Economy....and protectionism,is not the accepted way to improve...rather, constant involvement with Golbal reality,and assimilation of systems already proven by others ,with a mix of domestc touch and input..is the way to go.
..
Your friend,Bahram

[Mr.Good]

The way I see it, all our problems go back to the amateurish management at IFF and clubs (in fact everywhere).

we have 1.5 year till AC2011 and 3 years for WCQ2014. Is the IFF planning short term for the next week, month, year... or are they planning for the long term.

The was I see it, we should build a new team with youngsters from scratch. we need new blood, and we need this new blood to become thick (get experienced). The way I see it, the new team should be built for WC2014, i.e. we should use AC2011 and a venue to gain experience, not take old fallen stars to the trounament just to try and win something. Will the IFF plan ahead, or will they panic from the first loss and change coach etc.

Another question: Are the IFF officials themselves sure about their job security? If they cannot grantee their positions for the next month or year, what will make them plan ahead for the future ?

overall, I think we need Good management and stability in that management