Down the memory lane : Iran football in the seventies.

[perspolees]

bro, dont worry. today's players are also quite good.
I get a feeling you worry too much about the talent today, as evident in many other threads.
relax bahram jan.

I'd say apart from players like parvin, hejazi, ghelichkhani, and maybe rowshan, today's pack are stronger.
no disrespect to the heroes of the yore, but I must say today we have guys like navidkia the likes of passing & vision you'd be hard pressed to find in that era.
we have other talented midfielders like shojaei, mobaali, karimi ( if he werent such a lazy bum ) whose overall quality not only parallels the best of that era, sometimes, surpasses them too.


and you must remember, in 70's football was not as organized, streamlined professional entity that we see today. even in the best of nations. and an average athlete today is far superior to that of 70's, almost in every area.
so for all the love we have to our legends of the yore, I must say today's TM would definitely beat the 78 team.

with all due respect i disagree!
Football is a team work, and everything is proportional.

Stars will be stars we had them back then and we have them now they sparkle and fade...it is difficult to compare pele with say even maradona let alone compare thirty years agos players and talents with our current batch.

we have to compare the whole team iran to the whole asia or whole europe or whole world in those days and now. comparing players from past with players from now is very difficult. If we want to stratify calculable data you have to purify it as much as possible to get some meanig from the data that you are pooling to extract...

As such the only logical and reasonable conclusion would be that we were undoubtedly the king of asia and qualified to wc thru much tougher grouping/ setting and with a great safety margin back then, unlike the other recent two times.

I have no doubt in my mind that it would have been Iran who would have gotten to 82 and 86 instead of back to back Saudis...

It is also my opinion that the proportions of
Iran football / whole world football

was much larger of a number in 78 than what it is now

as such you cant say any team today beating the team thirty years ago because you have a time factor that you cant stratify to. you cant put brasil 2008 against brasil 1970 and say former beats the latter, because it is an impossible imagination, what you can compare
is brasil of 78/ world football
with brasil of 2008/ world football

in those equations i think you would get just about the same number...something that would not be true for Iran

[Ali Chicago]

Hehe, this reminds me of my dad's story about the 1968 Iran-Israel match. My dad, his 2 brothers and my grandfather wanted to see the match live. They went very early but the stadium was packed. They had to climb over the walls of Amjadieh and even then people were sitting on each others shoulders so you couldn't even see the game!
Because of this they left the stadium, my father and my uncles forced my grandfather to buy a tv right then and they immediately took it home and watched the game on TV.

I was only 6 at that time, I was listening to that game on the Radio. For some reason I only remember Mostfa Arab and Isrealie forward Speigel. But I maybe have mixed that with when Taj played Mccabeee in Asian club championship.

[Nokhodi]

I was watching this with my fellow kids from the neighborhood (we had one of the few black and white Schaub Lorenz tvs in the neighborhood and if a football game was televized, all the neighborhood kids were "Telep at our house". After the game on TV was done, ofcourse all the neighborhood kids were going out and playing gol koocheek in the neighborhood and try to imitate the moves by their football heros.
Good old days.

Hehe, this reminds me of my dad's story about the 1968 Iran-Israel match. My dad, his 2 brothers and my grandfather wanted to see the match live. They went very early but the stadium was packed. They had to climb over the walls of Amjadieh and even then people were sitting on each others shoulders so you couldn't even see the game!
Because of this they left the stadium, my father and my uncles forced my grandfather to buy a tv right then and they immediately took it home and watched the game on TV.

[Ali Chicago]

Goal keeping being a major concern in Iran nowadays , deserves some mention here.

I share Ali Agha's view on Abedzadeh....Never thought of him as a great goalkeeper in the class of Hejazi and Asli , he probably comes somewhere after Rasheedi and Movadat in my opinion.
I am guessing that very few of us here have actually seen the likes of Bayati in action , so I reserve judgment , but Hejazi in my view is the best Goalkeeper Iran has ever produced followed by Asli as distant second.

That is quite poor for a nation that has started playing international football since the forties. It highlights major shortcoming in producing quality goalkeepers.

Agha Majid, Aziz Asli was a great keeper too, but I was very young when he was on his haydays and I wasn't able to watch him live manytimes, that is why I didn't mention him. do you remember that game.
Speaking of Aziz Asli , I have a very interestign memory from him. He was from Azarbaijan and a very very emotional man. If my memory helps me right, I remember PP was playing against Benfica in a friendly and even Ozebio the black panther was playing for Benfica in that game. PP and Benfica were 0-0 until say 80th minute which was a great acheivement for PP. At that moment, Benfica scored one and Aslai couldnt' save the goal. He got so pissed at himself or somebody probably. So instead of standing in the goal, he stoold by the post, a passback by Jafar Kashani rolled into the goal, so did couple of other rolling back balls went into the goal. Perospolice lost that game 4-0 or 4-1 not sure. But I guess Asli was so mad at himself for the first goal or mad at somebody and made behaved in a non professional manner.

Coming to think of it, I dont' know why PP coach didnt' change him. Probably they were afraid he won't come out of the goal and makes more scenery.

Having said about this event, despite this goof up, Aziz Asli was a great keeper. He was very brave in coming out of the goal and good reflexes as well. By this memory didnt' mean to belittle Aziz Agha and his memories, it is just so wiered that still is stuck in my memory.

I was watching this with my fellow kids from the neighborhood (we had one of the few black and white Schaub Lorenz tvs in the neighborhood and if a football game was televized, all the neighborhood kids were "Telep at our house". After the game on TV was done, ofcourse all the neighborhood kids were going out and playing gol koocheek in the neighborhood and try to imitate the moves by their football heros.
Good old days.

[zzgloo]

With Hejazi.......Mansoor Rashidi ( TAJ ), Korbekandi ( Zob-Ahan ) ,and Hafez Tahooni ( Rah-Ahan ) ,Bahram Mavadat ( Perspolise ),Naser Sabetpoor ( Bank e Melli ),were all good keepers at the same Era.....,while there is no keeper currantly as good as any one these guys above....I also remember, sepahan of the past used to have a very fine keeper,who was thier captain as well...though I do not remmember his name .

[maij]

Goal keeping being a major concern in Iran nowadays , deserves some mention here.

I share Ali Agha's view on Abedzadeh....Never thought of him as a great goalkeeper in the class of Hejazi and Asli , he probably comes somewhere after Rasheedi and Movadat in my opinion.
I am guessing that very few of us here have actually seen the likes of Bayati in action , so I reserve judgment , but Hejazi in my view is the best Goalkeeper Iran has ever produced followed by Asli as distant second.

That is quite poor for a nation that has started playing international football since the forties. It highlights major shortcoming in producing quality goalkeepers.

[Ali Chicago]

if we are to compare "eras", then for example, keepers like abedzadeh fall into the present. so we are NOT as bad as it seems.

or in forwards' case, we have Daei, VH, ... to talk about.
....

.

Sorry for running in Pa Bereheneh here, but IMHO none of the three players you mentioned football skill level wise are among the top footballers of Iran. Abedzadeh was never consistant (even in famous Asutralia - Iran) in Melburn, he was never good in coming out of the goal on corner and free kicks. So no disrespect to Abedezadeh but he never was at the class of Hejazi IMHO.

Daie although brought Iran's name to the international level and I am thankful to him for that, football skill wise was never a great player (atleast since 1997that I was able to watch him on tv outside Iran). VH and his constant shol kon seft kon for the TM, definitly disqualifies him from being put in the hall of fame of our footballers.

Watch the movie Offside by Jafar Panahi, see the passion of our nation for the game. Our natioal team players have to realize they are playing for a nation that put so much regards to the soccer and have to honor that standard.

[zzgloo]

this is what I was talking about. we store all the positives and discard the negatives.
bahram jan, are you telling me rowshan was never denied or he always got his way? isnt that an impossibility?
same thing with parvin. are we to believe parvin's passes always found their mark, and they never got intercepted or go wayward ? another impossibility.
and just as you likened his to kia, shows Kia's case is slowly becoming the same. we are slowly forgetting many bad or sub par performances of kia and are retaining only his good ones.
it's a natural thing and man goes through this stage of nostalgia.
I can only say they were all good players with more good performances than bad ones, with some memorable games .and that's why they remain in our memories as heroes.

You are right...........they gave us lots of joy........and pride.............
I do admit, we have much more talents these days, and richer pool to chose from................
I must say, my all time faivorate player is Mahdavikia.....not neccesarly because of his talent, but because of his profesionalism, and consistancy.

[Doctor DOOM]

When Roshan had the ball.....it was gurranteed he would pass a defender,and go around him...no matter whom he was playing against........we do not have such player today.
when parvin had the ball, he was center of stablelity, when he had the ball, something happened.....very much like today's mahdavikia................

this is what I was talking about. we store all the positives and discard the negatives.
bahram jan, are you telling me rowshan was never denied or he always got his way? isnt that an impossibility?
same thing with parvin. are we to believe parvin's passes always found their mark, and they never got intercepted or go wayward ? another impossibility.

and just as you likened him to kia, shows Kia's case is slowly becoming the same. we are slowly forgetting many bad or sub par performances of kia and are retaining only his good ones.

it's a natural thing and man goes through this stage of nostalgia.

I can only say they were all good players with more good performances than bad ones, with some memorable games .and that's why they remain in our memories as heroes.

[BehzadB]

football is played at a much faster pace today than the football of the old days... much faster.. there is no comparison there

that's why comparing old football players with today's football players is an impossible comparison...

today, Pele would be just another great player, not the Pele that he is known to be today..

can you imagine how Ronaldinho would have been regarded had he been playing in the 70's?? Or mahdavi kia?? Speed and skill are common place in today's football, where as back in the old days, while Skill was common place , speed was a rarity...

[zzgloo]

payman jaan......It is true, one may think older era was better because of sentimental values etc,,,,,
Frankly,I very much try to be objective....thats why in my selection I chose many currant players.....but believe me....

When Roshan had the ball.....it was gurranteed he would pass a defender,and go around him...no matter whom he was playing against........we do not have such player today.

when parvin had the ball, he was center of stablelity, when he had the ball, something happened.....very much like today's mahdavikia.

hajazi, never,ever, recieved a cheap goal, you knew he would do what is needed.

sadeghi, was a nekonam, but faster !and much more energetic.

...............Today's players are equeipt with better coaching and better game plans, which we should not credit today's players for that.

Players we did not have , are likes of Nikbakht,mahdavikia,daei,hashemian ,karimi,kabei.................other than these six.............I do not see much , improvement.

[Doctor DOOM]

if we are to compare "eras", then for example, keepers like abedzadeh fall into the present. so we are NOT as bad as it seems.

or in forwards' case, we have Daei, VH, ... to talk about.

My belief is we, not only Iranians, but majority of human race, tends to over glorify the past and the farther that past, the bigger the exaggeration. is it nostalgia or whatever it may be, it IS true. this is a proven theory. and it's not restricted to football or Iranians either.
man tends to discard most of the negatives and store ( and even protect ) all that was positive of the past. Hence we just remember the high lights of X or Y ( tinged with some exaggeration, mind you ) and compare them with the present crop whose mistakes and negatives are current and we're living with.
for example, your own khodayari, today would be the most ridiculed and hated player becoz of his inability to pass or lack of pace or ... .

believe me, 20 years down the road, good players like teymoorian will be elevated to super-star status !
the same abedzadeh that we all tout today as a great keeper, in a period was absolutely horrifying on crosses coming from flanks. he used to make so many mistakes judging the ball that everytime the opponents crossed the ball from either flank, we used to shake with fear ! yet, look how we talk about him now. he certainly didnt look like ANY "oghaab" in that period

so bahram jan, you could say the same criticism in 70's about the 70's teams and rosters.
how did you feel when sadeghi/abdullahi amateurishly "attempted" the bicycle kick which went past hejazi, who ha dmis-communicated with his defender and then was unable to even deflect the ball from going into our net .... and subsequently, denied us getting a win against the much touted scots ?

----------------------

majid jan, I agree there are no parameters using which we could compare the two eras.
I also agree we were quite successful in the 70's. parallel with the rising power and influence of IRAN as a country. I dont see how we could host the asia cup once, and then do it again with one other country in between. ( not that I'm complaining ).

we shd also allow for the very limited and rather sub par quality of opponents in asia. I know numbers may show differently as there used to be 1 asian country for the 16 in the WC's. but numbers dont reflect the whole truth.
in that era if a country invested moderately in football, they'd make gigantic leaps over the rest. today, keeping the same relative measurements, this leap would not be all that much significant.


the gap between a good european team and a good asian team was much wider then than now. the number of tougher and competitive teams have multiplied many folds in each region, even asia. the philosophy has changed and to stand out it takes far far more hard work and talent than that time. and many other factors that I feel I shd avoid as I have already spoiled the good taste of the thread. I apologize for souring the mood and taste of the thread before-hand, to everyone.

Let me finish positively at least. I still say their accomplishments are to be praised and glorified. We are all proud of them and will forever keep them on a pedestal, justifiably.
But at the same time, we shd stay away from comparison when we have only positives of an era to remember while even they may have ( and indeed HAVE ) had many faults and shortcomings and lacks much like our present crop of stars and players.

[zzgloo]

[QUOTE=Doctor DOOM;887325] bro, dont worry.
payman jaan, you read me well....
I do worry,as I belive our talent pool has depleted....

No, goal keeper.
No,left back.
No stricker.
Old, over used, core players.
patch work of players from around the world.
Bad organization.
Risky,coching staff.
Exadurated talent levels.

.........................................
Our goal keepeing is a joke.
Our forwrds,are defenetly in lower standard than past......No, speed,no heading ( with daei gone ),
Our defense is equal...although, the centeral defense used to be much stronger.
Our midfield , lacks bursting speed, although talented, but the past, were not amaturs, with Ghlich,parvin, ghasempoor, and sadeghi.
............................
No, we do not have,Hejazi, roshan, or sadeghi, or parvin,or,Anderanik,or abdullahi, today.....
...........................
What we have, are emotionless bunch,whom either are too rich to care, or too old to care, or do not care much about thier country, or unproven .

[maij]

I always find it difficult to compare one generation to another in terms of skill. In fact , I doubt if there is any proper mechanism to do so in football. The only definite comparison is in terms of championships and accolades.

And when it comes to championship , I really doubt that this generation and a few after it can repeat or even come close to the 70's era. 3 consecutive Asian championship spanning from 1968 to 1976 , qualification for Olympic games 1972 & 1976 Qualification for the World Cup 1978 , winning 5 consecutive Asian Youth championship. Winning Asian games gold medal 1974 ... Amongst other success.

So, Peyman Jan .....despite the difficulty comparing tactical & technical standards , there is just no denying facts and figures and the accolades that Iran had in the 70's (pre-revolution era) to what we have now. I think Bahram was looking at that aspect of it as well......

[Doctor DOOM]

When I look at the picture 'bellow',of TM.....I am not sure if today's team any stronger........
Hejazi............................................ .Roodbarian ?
Kazorani,Abdullahi,Anderank,nazari..........Nosrat i,Kabei,? , ?
Sadeghi,ghasempoor,parvin................mahdaviki a,nekonam,Ando ?
Ghafoor,Roashan,Adelkhani...............hashemian, karimi,Nikbakht ?
.................................................. .....................If All could have played now, I would have chosen :
Hejazi
Anderanik, Abdullahi,kabie,kazorani
parvin,Sadeghi,mahdavikia
Roshan,hashemian,Karimi

bro, dont worry. today's players are also quite good.
I get a feeling you worry too much about the talent today, as evident in many other threads.
relax bahram jan.

I'd say apart from players like parvin, hejazi, ghelichkhani, and maybe rowshan, today's pack are stronger.
no disrespect to the heroes of the yore, but I must say today we have guys like navidkia the likes of passing & vision you'd be hard pressed to find in that era.
we have other talented midfielders like shojaei, mobaali, karimi ( if he werent such a lazy bum ) whose overall quality not only parallels the best of that era, sometimes, surpasses them too.


then again, I dont think we are ever going to suffer by way of "lack of talent". It's just a pro attitude and mentality that is in short supply.
and you must remember, in 70's football was not as organized, streamlined professional entity that we see today. even in the best of nations. and an average athlete today is far superior to that of 70's, almost in every area.
so for all the love we have to our legends of the yore, I must say today's TM would definitely beat the 78 team.