"Questioning The Wisdom Of Hiring Foreign Players"

[maij]

St_Mark Jan

[zzgloo]

My view on your questions:

I am not oppose topics such as political aspects of football in Iran, Government interference, abuse of power and mismanagement by IRI , but i am afraid you won't find anybody here
to disagree that government has failed in all those aspects

My own view of legionnaires and cost benefit.
Just like Martin I think there should not be any doubt domestic league will benefit from hiring
quality players and coaches but just like coach issue critical word is quality.

I don't see benefit of hiring mediocre foreign coach or players. Unless these players are experienced quality players clubs will not benefit and will end up wasting their limited resources.
In case of Foulad , with exception of januario ( several years ago) every other legionnaires has been disappointment and ended up early exit or on the bench.
They had Kaveh Rezaei , they let him go but hire a mediocre foreigner. They were trying hard to hire Jordanian keeper ( thnx heaven they failed because of $$) while beside Salimi they have Mazaheri (U23 ) and Ahaki (u20). Most of these trades are for benefit of brokers and dealers rather tham quality improvement.

I understand......so,we are to find a wisdom ,other than the obviouse.....

here are some related issues;

1- Club managers, look to hire forign players,when there are no domestic players available will the desired skill levels.
2- there seriouse shortages,in particular positions on the field in Iranian football..either permenant shortages ( due to cultural blind spots ), or short term shortages ...positions such as , Center forwards, seem to be cultural permenant shortages...and Goal keepers currant lack of good keepers.
3-Forign players seem to be " The last minute options ", when all els,fail,and a coach has to fill a Void,in a hurry.

[St_Mark]

Dear St_Mark....
This is not just football forum...it is football plus forum.....and " Plus " part,is where our exchanges stand....



...regarding the issue,
" If We should stay out of poletics in Iranian Football " ?

I don't think so, but there are place for everything otherwise we are going to mix our football with politics



Is Football in IRAN, same as every where els ?.

No and i don't know for sure if it has to be.

....does the government of IRAN keeps the poletics out of Football ?.

No .

....have you seen the propaganda slogans on players' T-Shirt ?..of all clubs ?
Yes

....have you noticed the propaganda value of football, ?.
yes

..the early game speeches ?.
seen that

....subsedizing clubs ?.
know about that........

We Can not stay out of poletics, when The islamic republic, shoves thier propaganda down our throat !!...

I agree with a reminder we should not do the same mistakes to mix our politics to every issues come across because of what government does.

and about the topic and stay true to the topic of this thread......
The question was what is the wisdom of hiring forign players ?.......and I answered it ......exactly within the subject.........

That i disagree , i think you just did what you accused government doing.
hiring of foreign players is just policy by IFF managers and one may agree or disagree without bringing in IRI... otherwise all we do will be tainted by politics.
one can discuss wisdom of land reform by late Shah without involving wisdom of Monarch or Monarchy.







I like to know, if any one els, can answer this wisdom better here.

My view on your questions:

I am not oppose topics such as political aspects of football in Iran, Government interference, abuse of power and mismanagement by IRI , but i am afraid you won't find anybody here
to disagree that government has failed in all those aspects

My own view of legionnaires and cost benefit.
Just like Martin I think there should not be any doubt domestic league will benefit from hiring
quality players and coaches but just like coach issue critical word is quality.

I don't see benefit of hiring mediocre foreign coach or players. Unless these players are experienced quality players clubs will not benefit and will end up wasting their limited resources.
In case of Foulad , with exception of januario ( several years ago) every other legionnaires has been disappointment and ended up early exit or on the bench.
They had Kaveh Rezaei , they let him go but hire a mediocre foreigner. They were trying hard to hire Jordanian keeper ( thnx heaven they failed because of $$) while beside Salimi they have Mazaheri (U23 ) and Ahaki (u20). Most of these trades are for benefit of brokers and dealers rather tham quality improvement.

[maij]

My friend....
what is the wisdom of giving millions ,when clubs make no revenue ?
what is the wisdom of giving millions to washed out ,retired players such as hashemian and mahdavikia ?
what is the wisdom of spending so much on football ,but asign non-football,non-experinced management ?
what is the wisdom of spending millions on some clubs but not on others by the government ?
what is wisdom of spending so much on players and coaches when teams do not have fields to practice ?
etc,etc.......
there are millions of other stupid ,without wisdom issue in other sectors of life and managements in IRAN....that have no reason behind them but the stupid poletics of Islamic republic you wish to avoid.

That is called corruption and corruption is rife in all walks of life in Iran not just football.

There is a lot of money in football and almost all of it comes out of the public funds/taxpayers/national resources fortunes. As much as it is popular and trendy to blame the government for such corruption , it is the people themselves who are corrupt and I mean people who engage in siphoning the money from the public using loopholes in the system or playing on people's sympathy and emotions, moral corruption , cheating and all that jazz. Football is such an easy ground to make money and you don;t have to be a top notch player to make a fortune.

[zzgloo]

topic is " "Questioning The Wisdom Of Hiring Foreign Players"
you have questioning wisdom of different issues. They all may be interesting subject but not the issue here.



yes i agree with you i am avoiding as you said millions of stupid without wisdom issues . It's not if am avoiding ( or not ) politics it's just my understanding that it's against PFDC rule that they prefer political issues be discussed in some other pages.

last season IFF had banned foreign goal keepers plying in IPL , that policy changed this season. One can question wisdom of both policies without injecting religion or politics into it.

years ago i concluded it's waste of my time and others to discussed political issues in this forum , sine often some members confuse politics with trash talk, insult, accusation, irresponsible argument. I do share and exchange my views in more restricted moderated communities and i have found it to be useful.

leaving politics for others I still post mostly about youth programs here with hope that interest others. Thanks heaven now there are many members involved and hopefully i will not need to post about that either.

Dear St_Mark....
This is not just football forum...it is football plus forum.....and " Plus " part,is where our exchanges stand....

I am well aware of our previouse exchanges,although long time ago...as I remember, I found you extreemly resourceful..and good in finding reletive articles in internet..specialy information within IRAN...I als remember your poletical stands...which,is only your own business.I also remember how smart and intelegent you are....
nevertheless......I like to appeal to your intelegence,and sense of fairness....regarding the issue, " If We should stay out of poletics in Iranian Football " ?
Is Football in IRAN, same as every where els ?.....does the government of IRAN keeps the poletics out of Football ?.....have you seen the propaganda slogans on players' T-Shirt ?..of all clubs ?....have you noticed the propaganda value of football, ?...the early game speeches ?.....subsedizing clubs ?.........
We Can not stay out of poletics, when The islamic republic, shoves thier propaganda down our throat !!...

and about the topic and stay true to the topic of this thread......
The question was what is the wisdom of hiring forign players ?.......and I answered it ......exactly within the subject.........
I like to know, if any one els, can answer this wisdom better here.

[Paradigm]

My friend....
what is the wisdom of giving millions, when clubs make no revenue?
what is the wisdom of giving millions to washed out, retired players such as hashemian and mahdavikia?
what is the wisdom of spending so much on football, but assigning non-football, inexperienced management?
what is the wisdom of spending millions by the government on some clubs but not on others?
what is wisdom of spending so much on players and coaches when teams do not have fields to practice?

^ Great points. I agree 100% with everything.

[Martin-Reza]

I don't think any somewhat knowledgable football fan would generally question the benfit of legionnaires in the domestic league.

[St_Mark]

My friend....
what is the wisdom of giving millions ,when clubs make no revenue ?
what is the wisdom of giving millions to washed out ,retired players such as hashemian and mahdavikia ?
what is the wisdom of spending so much on football ,but asign non-football,non-experinced management ?
what is the wisdom of spending millions on some clubs but not on others by the government ?
what is wisdom of spending so much on players and coaches when teams do not have fields to practice ?
etc,etc.......
there are millions of other stupid ,without wisdom issue in other sectors of life and managements in IRAN....that have no reason behind them but the stupid poletics of Islamic republic you wish to avoid.

topic is " "Questioning The Wisdom Of Hiring Foreign Players"
you have questioning wisdom of different issues. They all may be interesting subject but not the issue here.

there are millions of other stupid ,without wisdom issue in other sectors of life and managements in IRAN....that have no reason behind them but the stupid poletics of Islamic republic you wish to avoid

yes i agree with you i am avoiding as you said millions of stupid without wisdom issues . It's not if am avoiding ( or not ) politics it's just my understanding that it's against PFDC rule that they prefer political issues be discussed in some other pages.

last season IFF had banned foreign goal keepers plying in IPL , that policy changed this season. One can question wisdom of both policies without injecting religion or politics into it.

years ago i concluded it's waste of my time and others to discussed political issues in this forum , sine often some members confuse politics with trash talk, insult, accusation, irresponsible argument. I do share and exchange my views in more restricted moderated communities and i have found it to be useful.

leaving politics for others I still post mostly about youth programs here with hope that interest others. Thanks heaven now there are many members involved and hopefully i will not need to post about that either.

[zzgloo]

This topic and issue has it's own merit without injecting politics into it.

My friend....
what is the wisdom of giving millions ,when clubs make no revenue ?
what is the wisdom of giving millions to washed out ,retired players such as hashemian and mahdavikia ?
what is the wisdom of spending so much on football ,but asign non-football,non-experinced management ?
what is the wisdom of spending millions on some clubs but not on others by the government ?
what is wisdom of spending so much on players and coaches when teams do not have fields to practice ?
etc,etc.......
there are millions of other stupid ,without wisdom issue in other sectors of life and managements in IRAN....that have no reason behind them but the stupid poletics of Islamic republic you wish to avoid.

[St_Mark]

Wisdom ?!!
In Islamic Republic ??
In Iranian Football ??

This topic and issue has it's own merit without injecting politics into it.

[zzgloo]

Wisdom ?!!
In Islamic Republic ??
In Iranian Football ??

[St_Mark]

Last year Madrid University did study on impacts of hiring talented foreign players. research support the view that quality foreign players has positive impact for national team.
But was Spain and subject "talented foreign players" unlike in Iran that most of them are not better than IPL players.

I have not seen such study in Iran but recent IRNA article question such wisdom.

Researchers at Universidad Carlos III de Madrid are participating in a study that has determined that when high quality players from foreign countries are drafted to play on sports teams within a determined country, there is an improvement in the performance of that country's national team.

This research attempts to analyze the impact caused by the liberalization of the labor market in the world of sports brought about by the Bosman Rule. Specifically, the scientists have evaluated the repercussions that the large influx of foreign players caused on national competitions and on the performance of national teams. "This liberalization process has stimulated domestic competition and improved the performance of the national teams that play in national leagues more open to the entrance of foreigners", declares one of the researchers, Juan de Dios Tena, of the UC3M Statistics Department.

بازیكنان خارجی بطورمیانگین بابت هردقیقه بازی246هزارتومان پول میگیرند


تهران - بازیكنان خارجی فوتبال ایران هرساله حدود 11 میلیارد تومان از بودجه كشور را به خوداختصاص می دهند وهر دقیقه بازی آنان درلیگ فوتبال ایران حدود 246هزارتومان هزینه دارد.

به نقل از آماراستخراج شده از لیگ ایران، بازیكنان خارجی زیادی هر ساله وارد فوتبال كشورمی شوند كه شاید درمیان آنان نفراتی كمتر از تعداد انگشتان دست برای تیم های باشگاهی ما مفید باشند.این بازیكنان كه دربعضی مواقع ممكن است،حتی یك ثانیه هم برای تیم های خود بازی نكنند،افراد درآمد زایی برای دلالان و بعضی از مدیران می باشند.درلیگ87 - 88، 48 بازیكن خارجی وارد فوتبال ایران شدندكه آنها حدود 63539 دقیقه به میدان رفته اند وازاین بین 11بازیكن ازمیان این نفرات كمتر از 500 دقیقه برای تیم های خوددر مجموع به میدان رفته اند.این آمار هرساله بدتر شده است ودر لیگ 88 - 89، 49 بازیكن خارجی در لیگ برتر به میدان رفتند كه 59570 دقیقه سهم حضور آنها در لیگ بوده است كه 9 بازیكن زیر 500 دقیقه برای تیم های خود بازی كرده اند.با وجود ناموفق بودن این بازیكنان در فوتبال ایران اما بازهم در لیگ 89 - 90 شاهد افزایش این بازیكنان و هدر رفتن بیشتر بیت المال بوده ایم.دراین فصل 56 بازیكن خارجی وارد فوتبال ایران شده اند كه 59408 دقیقه در مجموع برای تیم های خود به میدان رفتند واز این بین 20 بازیكن بین از 2 برابر فصل قبل بیشتر زیر 500 دقیقه برای تیم های خود به میدان رفتند.این بازیكنان در این فصل 11میلیارد تومان بودجه را به خود اختصاص دادندكه معادل 196 هزار تومان در هردقیقه می باشد.درلیگ 90 - 91 هم 55 بازیكن خارجی وارد فوتبال ایران شدند كه شاید 10بازیكن از این جمع هم برای فوتبال ما مفید نبودند و تنها جای جوانانی را پر كردند كه از نظر مالی در حدی نبودند كه بتوانند دلالان را تامین كنند.55 بازیكن خارجی در طول فصل گذشته 53525 دقیقه برای تیم های خود به میدان رفته اند كه 21 نفر آنها زیر 500 دقیقه در میدان حضور داشتند.نكته جالب این است كه این بازیكنان در این فصل دقیقه ای 246 هزار تومان از تیم های خود پول دریافت كرده اند و در طول سال 13 میلیار تومان از بیت المال كه می شد برای تیم های پایه هزینه شود صرف این بازیكنان شده است