For the sake of God, please stop the childish coach comparisons!

[The-Red]

so can someone tell me how this appointment is different from Daie's selection????I mean is MK even more unqualified than Daie who has never even coach a team internationally???I mean come on, ppl don't like MK and his resume is not the strongest, and I don't like him either, but at least he has a resume.

[Doctor DOOM]

All I can say , DOC , is that you seem to have a very prejudiced understanding of the word "Facts".
For as long as I remember, you have portrayed every "OPINION" of yours as a "FACT" !

hmmm .... let me see.
if you can find me saying things like:

FACT : blah blah blah.... .
and then express my opinion, then you'd be right.

but when I say :
FACT: we saw SKorea up the ante near the end of the game in saudi and score their goals ..... blah blah blah
... then that IS a fact.

or

Fact: zareh's number of turn-overs, miskicks, ....
or
Fact: number of shots, number of X or Y
or
Fact: height of Gh rezaei, or speed of madanchi, or ...
or ....etc etc etc


unless we're in different dimensions.
are we?

until then, I wish you wouldnt try to label my comments as "cliche's" or ...

==================

and I dont think one shd expect "modesty" from one party while one allows twisting of facts , denial of truth, and unconditional support for an individual at the cost of the team.
nobody's an angel here, buddy.
not me, not you, not martin or any other fellow.
nobody.


now, I can understand some of you folks are very agitated and unhappy with MK's appointment.
and want to vent and whatnot.
but that still doesnt allow for double standards.

[maij]

Thank you Majeed jan, but that is not a compliment to me but an insult to the Forum, j/k

Compliment? ....what Compliment ??? I would not recognize a complement even it it hits me on the face


On a serious note though, knowing your interest in football and your passion for the game and Team Melli , plus yor wide knowledge , you make an excellent analyst....... Even Human will be proud of you

BTW: the job of the analyst is taken in Team Melli , apparently MK is doing the job himself and pocketing the wages

[maij]

1- that would be me. so what are you trying to say, agha majid?

2- how about "donkey" for "imaginative vulgarity" ? does "donkey" sit well with you?

3- a second read of posts here would do wonders, I prescribe.




well good for him.
I'm sure he is.
it's just that most his analyses proved to be wrong when his personal favoritism became mixed with the facts!
perhaps we shd step away from our likes and dislikes when we want to analyze games and teams.
that way, we could reach the truth better
dont you think so, agha majid?

[maij]

Majid jaan, please read my post directed to Faraz, it may show where my frustration came from. Also please take a look at some of the threads in FF of the last couple of hours if you got the time and you will see where I'm coming from



As for this part. Yes, there is no textbook, but it is obvious that the (few) points I mentioned (there are many more factors) can not be denied when comparing past and present coaches (specially when you go 15-20 years back).

Many many things have changed and way too many factors determine the performance and results of a team to just come up with some results (points/game average) to point out how one specific coach did better than the other from 15 years ago only because his points/game average is somewhat higher.

By doing that you are denying all the other factors (the ones I already mentioned, and many more that I didn't mention).

All I'm saying is that this constant comparisons of points/game averages and goals/game averages between Branko/Daei vs. other coaches will take us nowhere. The fact is that Branko is gone, same as Daei, that we are at a desperate 4th place and are almost eliminated.

Another fact since a few hours is that MK is the new coach and just like with Qn, whom I didn't want to become TM coach either, we have to support the coach and the team.

Nah Amin Jan....I did not see the supposedly heated argument in the other forum......

But ..once again...your point of view regarding coaches comparison is purely that (an opinion). One side cannot be given priority or credential over the other or vice versa .......simply because there is no defined or recognized system. AND...the reason for lack of it is because different people have differing opinions and one cannot fault the other .

Regardless....I think we must move on and hope that Team Melli does get 9 out of 9 points.

[Martin-Reza]

Yes, it was a very nice gesture of you to make that success wishing thread. Damet garm.

There is no option but supporting TM.

I think we are going down bigtime from now on (not just for this quali, but in upcoming years), but I see no alternative to going down with TM.

Some kind of fan matyrdom I guess .

[Doctor DOOM]

On the contrary , I think anyone who believes that Mayeli Kohan , or any other coach for that matter , has an effect on the outcome of the game in North Korea ....is ******* ( you can fill the space with any imaginative vulgarity )

1- that would be me. so what are you trying to say, agha majid?

2- how about "donkey" for "imaginative vulgarity" ? does "donkey" sit well with you?

3- a second read of posts here would do wonders, I prescribe.

AND for the record....Martin Reza has been one of the best analyst of the game of football I have seen on these forums for as long as I remember....
That it my viewpoint , of course. You are free to think otherwise.

well good for him.
I'm sure he is.
it's just that most his analyses proved to be wrong when his personal favoritism became mixed with the facts!
perhaps we shd step away from our likes and dislikes when we want to analyze games and teams.
that way, we could reach the truth better
dont you think so, agha majid?


=========================

now, a little bit about our famous "donkey's effect":

I believe if a coach ( or animal . whichever term that we're easy with) arranges the team well , according to the needs of the moment, and the form & nature of players ... our chances will increase.

rather than a coach who plays with 1 forward in a HOME game, gets equalized and still stays with 1 forward. falls behind and still sticks to 1 forward and forgets he has a freaking THIRD sub!

so, agha majid, to answer you short & sweet: YES, the choices a coach makes will weigh HEAVILY on the outcome of any game, NKorea game included.

am I sure MK will do the perfect thing and make all the correct decisions?
hell NO.
but at least I give myself a chance.



now, truth may be hard for some of us to swallow. that is human nature.
we cant help that.
but we certainly can help with " not throwing stones at others when we live in glass houses"

[Amin_]

Thank you Majeed jan, but that is not a compliment to me but an insult to the Forum, j/k

Amin is right, I got into a very childish argument with kaz and in that context this posting makes complete sense.

But we setteled it like sportsmen and are easy again after a tough fight.

lol @ Behzad, just theoretically is the Moshaver Fanei allowed to fire the coaching staff ?

Yes, it was a very nice gesture of you to make that success wishing thread. Damet garm.

[Amin_]

Majid jaan, please read my post directed to Faraz, it may show where my frustration came from. Also please take a look at some of the threads in FF of the last couple of hours if you got the time and you will see where I'm coming from

Anyway...since your issue is with comparing coaching performances and/or results , there is no text book or rule book to define the comparisons in order to conclude which one is better. Many fans , experts and journalist tried to do these comparisons and every single one comes up with his own ruling , criteria and grading system...in fact , you have created your own in the post , so why not let other people do the same ???

As for this part. Yes, there is no textbook, but it is obvious that the (few) points I mentioned (there are many more factors) can not be denied when comparing past and present coaches (specially when you go 15-20 years back).

Many many things have changed and way too many factors determine the performance and results of a team to just come up with some results (points/game average) to point out how one specific coach did better than the other from 15 years ago only because his points/game average is somewhat higher.

By doing that you are denying all the other factors (the ones I already mentioned, and many more that I didn't mention).

All I'm saying is that this constant comparisons of points/game averages and goals/game averages between Branko/Daei vs. other coaches will take us nowhere. The fact is that Branko is gone, same as Daei, that we are at a desperate 4th place and are almost eliminated.

Another fact since a few hours is that MK is the new coach and just like with Qn, whom I didn't want to become TM coach either, we have to support the coach and the team.

[Martin-Reza]

Thank you Majeed jan, but that is not a compliment to me but an insult to the Forum, j/k

Amin is right, I got into a very childish argument with kaz and in that context this posting makes complete sense.

But we setteled it like sportsmen and are easy again after a tough fight.

lol @ Behzad, just theoretically is the Moshaver Fanei allowed to fire the coaching staff ?

[BehzadB]

I agree. It don't matter anymore..

we have to beat NK.. even with ME and Doctor doom as the coach and MR as our Moshaver fanei..

[maij]

you see ... it is crap like this that makes ppl lose respect for you.

akhe agha jan, if a donkey could win AT NKorea, a team that has 10 points, while we have only 6 ... then with you immense intelect please explain to us just what koind of animal it takes to NOT WIN AT UAE where everyone else had got 3 points.
or did you forget ppl may turn around and ask you such a thing?
so why do you embarrass yourself so?


how come your mouth stays shut with a coach who even fails to win our HOME games, but suddenly a donkey can win away to the second team in the group?
really?
what does that say about you , I wonder?


dont talk rubbish pesar-e khoob.
remember the quick sand story I told you earlier.

On the contrary , I think anyone who believes that Mayeli Kohan , or any other coach for that matter , has an effect on the outcome of the game in North Korea ....is ******* ( you can fill the space with any imaginative vulgarity )

AND for the record....Martin Reza has been one of the best analyst of the game of football I have seen on these forums for as long as I remember....
That it my viewpoint , of course. You are free to think otherwise.

[Amin_]

Faraz jaan, you obviously misunderstood.

I did not mean to say to never compare coaches with eachother; I was talking about this habit of some to alwayss come up with only results and other stats to show how "superior" their favorite coach was and how bad the other candidate is.

And not only that, this is the case every single time a new candidate is beig introduced. At one point you have the "Branko supporters" coming up with all these stats to make a (pointless) point, and on the other side others trying to point out how this new candidate has a better record

I mean what's the point of discussing only results of matches from 15-20 years ago (and denying all other factors, see my first post), to say how Branko/Daei/Taghi were all better or worse than Naghi?!?!

Like I said, it was the same when Qn took over after the WC (Qn vs. Branko), it was the same after Daei took over (Qn vs. Daei), now it's Branko/Daei vs. MK.


Discuss the tactical aspects of the game and all that from past coaches to learn from them, but what's the point of representing dozens of game results from yearsss back in all these threads, arguing about how the points/game and goals/game averages?!


To be honest with all of you, I got a little sick after all those arguments between MR and Kaz in the football forum. It was getting so childish at one point that I just couldn't take it anymore (pls look at some of the threads in the FF of the last 5-6 hours)

[maij]

Amin Agha ...I don't exactly understand your frustration and anger ( at least it seems like it !).

Of course , life must go one regardless to the painful event of installing a pious extremist as a head coach for Team Melli ( apparently some one claims that MK is a highly educated man !!!! if this is Education , then ridam be ein education...I rather be bi-savad , but respectable and honrorable )

Anyway...since your issue is with comparing coaching performances and/or results , there is no text book or rule book to define the comparisons in order to conclude which one is better. Many fans , experts and journalist tried to do these comparisons and every single one comes up with his own ruling , criteria and grading system...in fact , you have created your own in the post , so why not let other people do the same ???

Beside , people have bias and will twist the methods the way they want to in order to favor their candidates.

[Doctor DOOM]

But still, a win in North Korea could even be achieved with a donkey on the bench.

you see ... it is crap like this that makes ppl lose respect for you.

akhe agha jan, if a donkey could win AT NKorea, a team that has 10 points, while we have only 6 ... then with you immense intelect please explain to us just what koind of animal it takes to NOT WIN AT UAE where everyone else had got 3 points.
or did you forget ppl may turn around and ask you such a thing?
so why do you embarrass yourself so?


how come your mouth stays shut with a coach who even fails to win our HOME games, but suddenly a donkey can win away to the second team in the group?
really?
what does that say about you , I wonder?


dont talk rubbish pesar-e khoob.
remember the quick sand story I told you earlier.