Iran - Saudi Post match comments

[the-ali]

I am glad im in football + and I want to thank you all in this thread for some good posts.

It is a pleasure to read something with quality rather then the typical b.s written in football forum mostly by our dear Sanat Naft fan

[BehzadB]

am not proud ,I do not believe in the head coach of our TM.....
.....................
The fact that, there is nothing we can do about TM head coaching now !!!, does not change my beliefe !......and I am sorry, if this view offends some ,members !........I realy am !...........
But, I like all of us, jumped so high,with The Nekunam's beautiful Goal !

That's a fair post. and I too can agree with a lot of things you said there. but then I remember that there is this thing called "beza-at".. and I remember that beza-at-eh ma hameeneh agha bahram..


from gov control, to fan behavior, from the selection of TM coach , to IFF elections and the whole state of affairs in our country, are all the result of our "beza-at" as a society.. that's what we have and that's what we are...

The way I see it, there is very little a TM coach can do to affect the progress of our football.. the notion that Daie or this coach or that coach is going to do this or that for our football is simply an irrelevant fantasy..

the correction of what is wrong has to come from the top (or should I say from the bottom).. it's the foundation that is messed up.. Put Afazeli in as the TM coach and give him the same players and there be very little difference in the performance...

the way I see it, our game against KSA was far better than the game we played against Japan in Japan in WCQ games 2005.. at least against KSA we had new players, new coaches and a lot of pressure because it was the first game.. In The game against Japan we and Japan had already advanced (so there was no pressure), our coach was a very good, foreign educated and WC experienced Branko who had 5 years with TM, with the same players he had had during that 5 years, and the performance in the first half was so bad that the Commentators (both English speaking) were laughing at the way TM was playing..

bottom line, agha bahram, as far as I remember, our footballing expectations have always been way ahead of our realities..

given all that, Daie is as good as any coach, even though he is not the right one, at this point. I think he has qualities that most of our other coaches don't, I just wish he was less parkhash-gar. we need to give him more time to see what he can do and hope for the best. don't we always?

[yashar_fasihnia]

bahram jan, if you said this was the game TM was outplayed the most, then I think you may have missed the game at Melbourne.
bro, we were getting "mochalleh" in the first half.... or rather until that maniac or blessing in disguise or angel ( call him whatever u like ) , jumped on the net.
that 55-60 minutes were the absolute WORST case of TM ever being "out-played" ( an understatement if u ask me) .
it was like Mike Tyson boxing against an 11 yr old asthmatic girl !

some how asthmatic girl survived in the end. probably must have bitten of tysons ear

[Doctor DOOM]

bahram jan, if you said this was the game TM was outplayed the most, then I think you may have missed the game at Melbourne.
bro, we were getting "mochalleh" in the first half.... or rather until that maniac or blessing in disguise or angel ( call him whatever u like ) , jumped on the net.
that 55-60 minutes were the absolute WORST case of TM ever being "out-played" ( an understatement if u ask me) .
it was like Mike Tyson boxing against an 11 yr old asthmatic girl !

[yashar_fasihnia]

Do you want me to say it here ?....or can it be PM ?

thats upto u, cos its ur confidential info not mine, but thanx for the pm anywayz.

[zzgloo]

Bahram jan with all due respect that's a bit emotional. Have you or anybody else considered the fact that we may not be as talented as we think of ourselves? At least the current team isn't exactly boiling with talent IMO. We sure do have some classy players, but compared to past teams and even compared to the Saudi's yesterday, we had very few who could match them in that department that we alway self proclaim to be best at in Asia.
Daei's player selections have always been questionable and in the Saudi match his initial player selection was almost catastrophic, but credit to him for rectifying most of his own primitive errors.

All in all I don't ever remember being so outclassed and made to look like a complete set of amateurs facing any asian teams to this degree before and I hope I don't live to see it again. Thank god for the ref, for our luck and our physical condition.

I really hope Mr Daei who showed good signs, which makes up for his mistakes in this match, really takes a look at our own league and revises his player selections, at least based on the opponent we're facing. On this very same line and as Hadi said, I too have to stress once more that unfortunately our defenders, neither Hosseini or Aghili are individualy that great, diverse or intelligent(football wise). They are good at IPL kevel but nothing to rely on totally for international level.
In a modern game, we often see a pair of central defenders, where one stands for brute force and muscle power, while the other should stand for intelligence and ball control apart from being a decent defender. Or at least one of them should be considerably fast. The pair of Aghil, Hosseini only cover the muscle and force part, but lack desperately at the rest. I even warned for this before the match in another topic.

The rest of the points have already been mentioned, but I needed to stress and beg for a revision on player selections.

Purple_haze jaan..
I also, had never seen, any team, let alone an arab team, to have so many chances of goal against our TM...not even, top European teams .
...They say, TM has more than 50 million supporters in Iran....where, people have very little els, to be enthusiastic about.....
It will be ,hugely sad....if this coach plays with so many people's aspirations !

[zzgloo]

a bit offtopic but,

now that u say ur "long life" bahram jan, may i know how old u r??

i always wondered who the oldest member of PFDC was and for some reason, i thought its u (or perspolees) and i even told masoud. he said someone else though, but that person turned out to be in his late 20s not sure if masoud remembers that discussion of ours

Do you want me to say it here ?....or can it be PM ?

[yashar_fasihnia]

a bit offtopic but,

now that u say ur "long life" bahram jan, may i know how old u r??

i always wondered who the oldest member of PFDC was and for some reason, i thought its u (or perspolees) and i even told masoud. he said someone else though, but that person turned out to be in his late 20s not sure if masoud remembers that discussion of ours

[zzgloo]

I am not proud ,I do not believe in the head coach of our TM, but I can not help it, ...and I will try to do my best,not to elianate some members here, who may get offended by members such as me !.....I will do my best to keep thier cyber freindship !

through out my life....I had never ever seen, our TM be out played so bad..the way TM was ,during the first half,against the saudi's.......Not even,against Portugal ,in the WC, had the opponanat had as many chances for Goal against us as the saudis did........and in my opinion, if it was not because of thier coach's mistake ( thanks God ),they would have continued the same on the secound half.

Every body, knew, what our streangth,against the saudi''s ,was.!...which was supposed to be our Midfield !.....but, ironicaly, it was our midfield that was dominated the most,during the first half.

Other than the desparate rush, to score ,in the last 25 minutes, the TM had no, cohesiveness......and never in the whole game, was any design noticeable with TM !.....while we were told,TM was prepared for the saudi's .and all these after many other qustionable TM outputs.

We keep,critisizeing our players....and players' selection....but,the fact of the matter is,....that,they,the players,have not been helped !!!.....
In the total ,view, the players can look good, if the the coach's game plan works !!.....and the players look bad, the other way around......

Plus, players eventualy lose respect, and thier beliefe in a coach ,whom has repeatedly been wrong by his assessments....and pre-evaluations of the opponanats.

.................

During the TM camps......TM ,has Mr. Human afazeli....and a Goalkeepers coach...and Mr.Daei...and no other assisstants,with between 35 to 50 players ...........while , our coach spends good amount of his energies and time to respond to hasheiehs he himself created....and while his experince and qualifications were in question to begin with............
Therefore, I conclude,TM is under coached !from different aspects!..time wise,quality,as well as quantity.
.....................

The fact that, there is nothing we can do about TM head coaching now !!!, does not change my beliefe !......and I am sorry, if this view offends some ,members !........I realy am !...........
But, I like all of us, jumped so high,with The Nekunam's beautiful Goal !

[BehzadB]

Tough place against a tough team.. We didn't look good at all in the first half, but improved in the second half. KSA wasn't in top form either.. a few bounces this way or that way, we could have won 3-1 or lost 4-1..

I think if the team improves on the sides (wings) specially the left side, we'll have no problem getting to the WC as one of the top two teams of the group.

Another area that I think needs some improvement is the central defense..

[yashar_fasihnia]

Iran played 4-2-3-1
Ando and Nekoo were the two DMs. Despite what the two analysts on IRIB kept repeating. The change in the second half was Shoaji instead of playing in the center behind Hashemian, kind of pushed even more forward on the right, almost 4-2-2-2 (hasemian and Shojai).
Rahmati
Gholam nezhad Hosseini Aghili Zare
Ando Nekkoo
Rezai Zandi
Shojaii
Hashemian
The movement range Rezaie was longer and he at time was playing almost like a classic winger.
Even Fox Channel in US showed the same formation I mentioned above.

sorry but i disagree, iran did play 4-4-2 diamond. irib, TV3 as well as tapesh (mehran molkara was the analyst also confirmed it).

----------------------------------------rahmati--------------------------------------------
----gholamnejad------hosseini----------------aghili--------------zare------------
--------------------------------------nekounam----------------------------------------
--------------------ando---------------------------------------zandi-------------------
----------------------------------------shojaei------------------------------------------
--------------------------rezaei-------------------------hashemian------------------


i watched the game replay today again on dubai sports, and im 100% sure it was 4-4-2 diamond. nekounam was our only DM with ando and zandi as our RM and LM respective and shojaei playing as playmaker behind the 2 strikers.


btw if mansoor is reading this thread, congratz to him! i think he has become quite a regular of the show and im sure exchanging ideas and opinions with someone as intelligent and expert like mehran molkara is a great experience! damet garm agha mansoor!

[Doctor DOOM]

again, the same "sweeping the dirt under the rug" mentality.

covering mistakes and deficiencies by the numbers on the score-board.

honestly, how many of you all think the right midfield was even average, let alone above average? we had a gran tptal of 2 correct crosses from the right in the whole of 90+ minutes.
both crosses were from a stationary position. which means we had absolutely NO cross off a sprint, which subsequently means our right side mid never stretched the left defender to create a space between him and the central defenders.
we also had NO cut-back passes from the right side coming off the RW cutting in and passing back.
we didnt have any penetrations into the 8 from wide position also.
( I am not surprised by the replies, coz the same ppl claim a team doesnt need width !!! LOOLL )



Our defense was weak and got exposed time and again. a slightly more proficient team would have converted the other 3 chances ( 2 shots went past the goal post and the header above zareh's head ) ... not to mention the penalty call that could have been called also.

all this is becoz some of us fooled ourselves by looking at the score-lines against crappy waff teams and azerbaijan and kuwait and .... etc. and we're doing it AGAIN !!

absurd.

--------------

did it need 4 years of working under Lippi or Wenger to see the squad didnt have a right mid specialist and we were going to come up short in that post before the game? Did you have to be a coach to recognize this matter ? did you even need a crystal ball to see the future ?
NO.
It was OBVIOUS. it was predicted. it was discussed many many times.
and look what happened in the game: as predicted.


==================

btw, I think it was more like 4-1-3-1-1 ( as weird as it looks ) with rezaei occupying the space between the mid and VH. he was never on par or level with VH to give him lateral support. lateral support which would have pulled at least ONE defender off VH's back.

[Martin-Reza]

Oh boy dark smell of sarcasem right across the big pond.
DD was effective in his campaign against Sadeghi. He has to work a bit harder to get rid of Zareh and then two for two. 50% ain't a bad record.

lol, but the point is that some people act as if Daei made about 5 beginners mistakes which were so obvious that everyone would have done better. Now that we got a draw in an away match against an Asian powerhouse rated higher than us by international sources, this means with a somewhat average coach (which Daei doesn't even seem to be) we must have thrashed them.

I really think that's unrealistic. We did well and that means the coach can't have done too much wrong. And surely only very very few things we could do better, if any at all.

[purple_haze]

We can always use the Sepahani duo
Aghili and Bengar.

Well, I don't know if that would be any improvement really because Bengar is essentially a copy of Hosseini. Maybe somewhat better ball control, but only comapred to Hosseini and instead with a tendency to make way too many fauls which is something Aghili is doing well on his own right now. If only Aghili would be a bit faster and used his brain a bit more (because I see the potential at least more than Hosseini) instead of resorting to over aggression all this would be fine. But his over aggression is just due to lack of speed and timing, which he could compensate for by being a bit smarter.

But overall as I said, he's still better than or should I say compared to both Hosseini and Bengar. The key is finding someone to pair up with him with speed and brain or at least one of those qualities.

[Masoud_A]

Masoud jan, Aghili is a decent defender individually and one of the best at IPL level, but at least not in pair with Hossini at TM. One of them has to sit out and right now Aghili is a little better than Hosseini. BUt both of them as a pair don't cut it internationally.

We can always use the Sepahani duo
Aghili and Bengar.