Interesting fact about TM squad & Branko

[Mansoor]

Of the squad for 2004 Asian Cup, only 12 players are with TM for the 2006 World Cup. That is a variation of 11 players in 2 years!

So much for Branko not giving a chance to new players & being sold to same and so on .... unless, we expect him to crack into the line up that are filled with 6 legioners ....

[taha]

interesting fact - maybe some people will stop bashing branco for this now

taha

[arsham]

interesting fact - maybe some people will stop bashing branco for this now
taha
i zagree

[yashar_fasihnia]

Of the squad for 2004 Asian Cup, only 12 players are with TM for the 2006 World Cup. That is a variation of 11 players in 2 years!
So much for Branko not giving a chance to new players & being sold to same and so on .... unless, we expect him to crack into the line up that are filled with 6 legioners ....

:bigup:

bekhoda keyf mikonam hamejure branko mizane tu dahanaye un adamaye gheyre manteghi va kur!

yet, they find something to complain about! :rolleyes:

[Martin-Reza]

thanks for pointing out

[AliOlia]

unfortunetly this shows how stupid most iranian soccer fans are. Harsh i know, but true. We dont even look at facts before we judge. Such a simple fact as this, couldnt even be seen until now

[Muradistan]

Why have so many players who at one time played in Ahvaz been cut? Taghipour, Mobali, Alavi, Badavi, Kameli Mofrad.

Anyways the best 11 Iran used in AC were..

Mirzapour
Golmohammadi
Rezaei
Kaebi
Nosrati
Nekounam
Mahdavikia
Karimi
Daei
Alavi
Zare...the last 2 were used often because of the suspensions.

Besides those last 2 the only difference to todays best 11 is the inclusion of Zandi and Hashemian, 2 foreign based players. Can't say I see much change, to the starting 11, but yes the subs have changed quite often but what difference does it make who the subs are if they aren't used.

[IRN Rugby Playa]

badaavi wa suspended not alavi

[Muradistan]

badaavi wa suspended not alavi

I never said Alavi was suspended bro, I said Alavi and Zareh played more than they would've because of the suspensions to Rezaei, Alavi, Nosrati.

[Paradigm]

Why have so many players who at one time played in Ahvaz been cut? Taghipour, Mobali, Alavi, Badavi, Kameli Mofrad.

There has traditionally been pressure from the IFF administration, based in Tehran, to focus as much as possible on the selction of the Tehrani club players in the TM.

They in fact persue this as a (perhaps unwritten) policy to continue to preserve their power base in the capital.

However after the huge disappointment of not qualifying in 2002 for the World Cup, the IFF sort of relaxed on this policy and allowed a selection of mostly "shahrestani-based" young squad for the Busan 2002 games under Branko and this led to a great result, winning the games in that year.

Later these same U-23 era players were to make up the backbone of the TM for the Asian Cup 2004. That is why suddenly you saw so many Khuzestani players in the squad, all coming from the selection of the Busan games.

After the Asian Cup though, IFF again started pushing things back towards their traditional policy of centering the TM selection primarily on Tehran club players. Again we only have at most one or two shahrestani players in the squad from each region of the country.

[Mansoor]

Why have so many players who at one time played in Ahvaz been cut? Taghipour, Mobali, Alavi, Badavi, Kameli Mofrad.

Anyways the best 11 Iran used in AC were..

Mirzapour
Golmohammadi
Rezaei
Kaebi
Nosrati
Nekounam
Mahdavikia
Karimi
Daei
Alavi
Zare...the last 2 were used often because of the suspensions.

Besides those last 2 the only difference to todays best 11 is the inclusion of Zandi and Hashemian, 2 foreign based players. Can't say I see much change, to the starting 11, but yes the subs have changed quite often but what difference does it make who the subs are if they aren't used.

Let me see, we have 6 foreign based players that gets paid million or so to play football. We have Daei & Kaebi, one is holding world record, the other is a candidate by fifa to become the youngstar of WC. That is our top 8 players that you can't touch. Out of 3 remaining, we have Mirzapour which we have no replacement for and if any, nothing different. That is 9. Then, we have Nosrati & Zareh which are debatable. That is the eleven. Is that Branko's fault too that they are up there? Let me see, let's crack into the line up and replace our foreign based players with our IPL players that can't beat Al Karameh and Al hatchalHaf ... Great idea :rolleyes:

We have half of our squad changed from Asian Cup to World Cup in 2 years and we still see the other half! I guess this is a very good example of seeing half full & half empty!

[Mansoor]

....

If your theory is true, then how come Kaabi is there? Isn't he from Khuzestan?
Wait, then how come Mirzapour is there? Isn't he from Lorestan?
Wait, then how come Satar Zareh is there? Isn't he from Fars?
Wait, how come Bakhtiarizadeh is there? Isn't he from Khuzestan?
Wait, how come Madanchi is there? Isn't he from Gilan?
Wait .... never mind. Too many holes as usual ...

[webmaster]

Thanks Mansoor jan.. as always the best posts.. this one priceless.

[Mansoor]

Chakerim

[Muradistan]

Let me see, we have 6 foreign based players that gets paid million or so to play football. We have Daei & Kaebi, one is holding world record, the other is a candidate by fifa to become the youngstar of WC. That is our top 8 players that you can't touch. Out of 3 remaining, we have Mirzapour which we have no replacement for and if any, nothing different. That is 9. Then, we have Nosrati & Zareh which are debatable. That is the eleven. Is that Branko's fault too that they are up there? Let me see, let's crack into the line up and replace our foreign based players with our IPL players that can't beat Al Karameh and Al hatchalHaf ... Great idea :rolleyes:
We have half of our squad changed from Asian Cup to World Cup in 2 years and we still see the other half! I guess this is a very good example of seeing half full & half empty!

Riiight, so all the changes Branko has made has been to subs. Nothing thats really affected the TM so how is this showing us that Branko's broad minded when it comes to TM selections. He's not. Basically we agree there are the half dozen or so untouchables. But the weak areas are where I want to see change, and thats what alot of people are calling for. Which right now is Mirzapour, Zareh, and even Nekounam of late. 20 minutes as a sub for a player isn't a chance. For each of those 3 there are possible candidates who can fit better into the TM schemes but Branko hasn't given the chances to them.

Zareh-Sadeghi, Amirbadi, Madanchi, Bakhtiarizade
Mirzapour- Taleblou, Roudbarian
Nekounam-Mobali, Shojaei, Jabbari(injured now)...etc

I would just like to see more of the subs being called up given decent shots at overtaking a starting position, and not just be called up for the sake of it.

[Mansoor]

^ First of all, Zandi, Hashemian, & Zareh are 3 out 11 changes in starters from then. That is about 30% change in 2 years in starting line up.

Second, the topic was Branko giving chances to players and not being with the same "squad" (not "starter") as some have claimed in many occasions. Now, if your preference is someone in particular to start, that is not Branko's problem. That is your problem. Branko has changed half of the squad and has given them a chance to shine. Has Kazemian shined over Kia? Has Mobali shined over Karimi? Has ANYBODY shined over Nekunam? Has Roudabarin with that embarrasing goal vs Costa Rica shined over Mirzapour? Rahmati (vs Qatar) or Kameli or Alavi.... These players are given chances, and they have failed miserably (e.g. Iran vs Japan in Tokyo), including your favorite player Mobali. That is NOT Branko's fault, that is IPL for you. We get so tied up watching IPL and players shinning there we forget about the level of the plays. Have you checked the ACL scoreboard today? That is reality check my friend.

Branko does his job to bring various players into the camp and give them a chance. Have you been to the camp to watch them practice? If not, I have a video that should be posted by tommorrow. It is a sample of what you don't see ....

And as for the line up, stay tuned to see "more" changes soon ....

[Paradigm]

If your theory is true, then how come Kaabi is there? Isn't he from Khuzestan?
Wait, then how come Mirzapour is there? Isn't he from Lorestan?
Wait, then how come Satar Zareh is there? Isn't he from Fars?
Wait, how come Bakhtiarizadeh is there? Isn't he from Khuzestan?
Wait, how come Madanchi is there? Isn't he from Gilan?
Wait .... never mind. Too many holes as usual ...

My point was not where the players originate from. The issue was if they play for a Tehran-based club or not. Madanchi and Bakhtiarizadeh play for Tehrani clubs. IFF traditionally likes to limit the number of shahrestani based players in TM, to 1 or 2 per region.

There are not any reliable subs for either Mirza or Kaabi in the roster with enough proven experience and that is why they are not dropped (remember the Oman match in AC 2004 where Kaabi was benched and we saw what happened?)

Zare's inclusion on the other hand is somewhat of a mystery to me. Maybe because Branko's brother is coaching the Barghe' Shiraz?

[Ata]

I think that it´s good that we have players in the starting line-up who has played with each other a long time, the only thing that is bothering me is Mirzapours bad performence lately...

[gdoggali]

Also don't forget these changes are not the result of Branko's sudden enlightenment. Hardly, the football experts inside and oustide Iran, as well as simple fans, have called for the inclusion of these players for years. I mean when your back is against the wall, like Branko's was this past year, what do you expect him to do? Of course he had to throw away some of his stubborness and finally listen to pure logic.

The reason for the inclusion of these players was not because of Branko, rather because of pressure by media, football experts, and ordinary fans.

By the way, how come every thread you make is supposed to point out something about Branko, and always positive? Can you even make a thread where you don't talk about Branko, or better yet, critisize him in some respect.

But time is up for this kind of stuff, we have Branko and these players for TM. Lets just support them, and get away from your agenda here which is to say, "SEE, Branko was right all along, I win you lose." I thought the call was for unity among TM fans in full support of TM, not to make childish "I told you so threads."

[webmaster]

yeah my friend when you start to listen to people too much, you forget to be you!! have you thought of that?

[toofan]

look i changed my sig to support branco.
:)

[Ala]

Of the squad for 2004 Asian Cup, only 12 players are with TM for the 2006 World Cup. That is a variation of 11 players in 2 years!
So much for Branko not giving a chance to new players & being sold to same and so on .... unless, we expect him to crack into the line up that are filled with 6 legioners ....

execpt for daei, kia and karimi all others are invited by branko/blaz.

rahman rezaei and golmohammadi = Iran WC02
kaabi, nosrati, nekonum = Asian Cup 02
Nikbakht and Navidkia = Asian Cup 02
zandi and hashemian = WC Qual Stage 1
Zare = Asian Cup04

and the new crowd:

Teymoorian, Madanchi, ...

BUT, it is not right to think that Branko will change things! He won't.
His starters are same as Asian cup with 2 exceptions "Alavi/Badavi" and "Kameli/Taghipour"
He recruited Zandi and Hashe to replace these two!

as i always have said, branko's roster was decided 1.5 years ago. here it is again:
http://shushtar.com/pic/tm-roster4.jpg

[ashegetoop]

look i changed my sig to support branco.
:)
What about Daei? Should he stand as Goali maybe?
Put this in your mind dude, the main problem with a loser like Branco is that he has no autority in T.M.
Daei is a great player and he is the best we have ever had, but Branco won't dare ever putting him as a sub or letting others start any game instead for him.
Daei has the SRGHOFLI of our team and Branco is just an orgenizer.
I wish Daei luck and i hope he show what he stands for, but it is a reality of our T.M.

I bet Daei will play 270 minutes +/- (injury times) in WC 2006, before the whole squad return home.

[purple_haze]

Wait, how come Madanchi is there? Isn't he from Gilan? ...

Don't you mean fars Mansour jan?

[purple_haze]

Why have so many players who at one time played in Ahvaz been cut? Taghipour, Mobali, Alavi, Badavi, Kameli Mofrad.

Being from or playing in Ahvaz has nothing to do with them being cut:

Taghipour: Not the same player of AC'04 form and has disciplinary problems too (islamic games, internal problems with players?)

Mobali : the only one of the bunch that I think should have been included so no argument there.(other reasons behind his exclusion)

Alavi : wasn't special before and is now waaaaaay worse, just watch Foolad's games where he isn't even starting anymore.

Kameli: same as above plus the fact that him playing and starting for TM was a mystery to me even back then as he has no ball handlig skills what so ever, even the slightest required of a player at u-13 level. I had a minor heart attack every time the ball went his way!

Badavi: simply no end to his stupidity. Every player with 1/1000 brain would try to play as well and regularly as possible 1 yr prior to WC, but this guy changes clubs, doesn't get to play and instead of fighting and getting better for a starting spot he goes back crying to his old club , knowing that they legally can't use him for the domestic season.

[Mansoor]

Don't you mean fars Mansour jan?

PH jaan, he is originally from Gilan, but played for Fajr before joining Perspolis.
cheers.

[Hajagha]

Of the squad for 2004 Asian Cup, only 12 players are with TM for the 2006 World Cup. That is a variation of 11 players in 2 years!
So much for Branko not giving a chance to new players & being sold to same and so on .... unless, we expect him to crack into the line up that are filled with 6 legioners ....

Very interesting argument indeed, but let see if we can conclude a different story from the very same fact:

Well, let's see how many changes he makes in his 11 starters? When he has been proven over and over that our bench players are not too bad to sit on the bench for ever. Specially in AC2004.

As much as you are right about players performance and changing them, you may think how come only our reserve team can't keep up with the team and lose their quality to be changed with some other bunches? Shouldn't it be true for some starters as well? How come 10 of 11 starters are always on top form while the other 12 of 12 (reserve team) can't keep their form?

About 6 legionnaires:
1, Is it a automatic green light? Then we missed many of them in UAE.
2, Why 6? I count only 5. One of them played only 20 minutes in the last season.
3, I assure you if there was no problem for the language, culture, advertising, politics, TV right and copy right (for opening new market) and some other unrelated issues to football, we would have so many more legionnaires and not being too satisfied by a few of them only being there.

All in all, we all know Branko behaved different in his last call up, good for us though, we shouldn't extend this that he was always like that. His biggest short coming was lack of competition in 11 starters in TM who cost us many great players. One example would be Hashemian.

You think how many time a player can sit on the bench and watch his rival player plays no matter how he performs and the only chance he may get is by the officials when we slap each others or being red carded? We were proved not too long when you think about those 12 payers have been dropped since two years ago.

Cheers

[Ala]

PH jaan, he is originally from Gilan, but played for Fajr before joining Perspolis...


i always thought that he is for sure from fars since madanchi has deep shirazi accent. here is his bio from ghermezeteh.com

نام : مهرزاد
نام خانوادگی: معدنچی
نام پدر: قلی
شماره شناسنامه: 2-39096-228
متولد: 20/10/57 شیراز
قد: 180 وزن:75 پست: پیستون پای تخصصی:چپ
فوتبال را در سال 69 ودر باشگاه پاس آغاز کرد .اولین تیمی که رسما در آن مشغول به بازی شد تیم نوجوانان گسترش سایپا به مربی گری آقای مجید فشخامی بود.بعد از آن در باشگاه های بهمن ،سایپا برق شیراز و در نهایت پرسپولیس تهران بازی کرد که در زمان مربی گری آقای راینر زوبل در این تیم چهره شد و توانست بازیهای خوبی را از به نمایش گذارداو همکنون دانشجوی رشته تربیت بدنی میباشد
.

[Mansoor]

Very interesting argument indeed, but let see if we can conclude a different story from the very same fact:
Well, let's see how many changes he makes in his 11 starters? When he has been proven over and over that our bench players are not too bad to sit on the bench for ever. Specially in AC2004.
As much as you are right about players performance and changing them, you may think how come only our reserve team can't keep up with the team and lose their quality to be changed with some other bunches? Shouldn't it be true for some starters as well? How come 10 of 11 starters are always on top form while the other 12 of 12 (reserve team) can't keep their form?
About 6 legionnaires:
1, Is it a automatic green light? Then we missed many of them in UAE.
2, Why 6? I count only 5. One of them played only 20 minutes in the last season.
3, I assure you if there was no problem for the language, culture, advertising, politics, TV right and copy right (for opening new market) and some other unrelated issues to football, we would have so many more legionnaires and not being too satisfied by a few of them only being there.
All in all, we all know Branko behaved different in his last call up, good for us though, we shouldn't extend this that he was always like that. His biggest short coming was lack of competition in 11 starters in TM who cost us many great players. One example would be Hashemian.
You think how many time a player can sit on the bench and watch his rival player plays no matter how he performs and the only chance he may get is by the officials when we slap each others or being red carded? We were proved not too long when you think about those 12 payers have been dropped since two years ago.
Cheers

Ooh, Haji jaan, many many incorrect statements in short post. Az to bayeed bood. Any how:

a. Your numbers about the starters is not correct. Out of 11 starters in Asian Cup, 8 of them are the starters now, not 10. That is a change of 30% which is relatively similar to change of 50% in overall team(12 out of 23 staying). And should be lower for the starting line up as it is, since there are many advantages to "justified" stability.

b. How in the world someone with your intelligence is connecting Branko to the problem with IPL and club level. If our players such as Alavi & Kameli fail, it has NOTHING to do with Branko & TM. It has everything to do with the club training, discipline, conditioning, and players will.

RE 1. Actually, you answered yourself. Of course it is not "automatic" as we have legioners in UAE that are not here. 5 out of 6 legioners ARE from Europe & yes, but default it is true that these Eurpean based players are "by far"(key word) better than their IPL competition. The other which is Nekunam as the only one from UAE at the moment could have and should have been in Europe if not for Denizli & Ajorloo.

RE 2. The subject was refering to the past. What has happened to Zandi is afterward and relates to his current situation which will "most likely" reflect in our upcoming set of starters. He was a permanent starter for his club when invited and played for Iran during qualifiers. Your logic is using the future problem to complain about the past decision as if Branko had a magic ball to see Zandi will only play 20 minutes next year therefore we should avoid starting him even if he is a starter in top five league in the world at the moment!

RE 3. Really Haji jaan? Do you really think our IPL players in current form and current coaching and current facilities are ready for Europe (and would be there if not for technical reasons)???? Did you hear our IPL & Hazfi cup champions lost yesterday to alghorazeh & alghomeyisheh from countries below top 50 in the world and got eliminated? .... again .....

[Mansoor]

i always thought that he is for sure from fars since madanchi has deep shirazi accent. here is his bio from ghermezeteh.com

نام : مهرزاد
نام خانوادگی: معدنچی
نام پدر: قلی
شماره شناسنامه: 2-39096-228
متولد: 20/10/57 شیراز
قد: 180 وزن:75 پست: پیستون پای تخصصی:چپ
فوتبال را در سال 69 ودر باشگاه پاس آغاز کرد .اولین تیمی که رسما در آن مشغول به بازی شد تیم نوجوانان گسترش سایپا به مربی گری آقای مجید فشخامی بود.بعد از آن در باشگاه های بهمن ،سایپا برق شیراز و در نهایت پرسپولیس تهران بازی کرد که در زمان مربی گری آقای راینر زوبل در این تیم چهره شد و توانست بازیهای خوبی را از به نمایش گذارداو همکنون دانشجوی رشته تربیت بدنی میباشد
.

Ala jaan, I can already see your source not being correct. Look at the list of the clubs, he never played for Bargh shiraz. He played for Fajr. Nevertheless, he might be. For some reason I had him from Shomal.

[Mansoor]

...
BUT, it is not right to think that Branko will change things! He won't.
His starters are same as Asian cup with 2 exceptions "Alavi/Badavi" and "Kameli/Taghipour"
He recruited Zandi and Hashe to replace these two!
as i always have said, branko's roster was decided 1.5 years ago. ....

Not correct Ala jaan. 3 starters have changed from Asian Cup, not two. And the subject was never about the starters but the SQUAD. The subject was re-routed by those who wish to continue seeing the "other half" empty even now. And I am sorry, the roster was NOT "decided" 1.5 years ago. It is not even decided YET!!!

[Mansoor]

Also don't forget these changes are not the result of Branko's sudden enlightenment. Hardly, the football experts inside and oustide Iran, as well as simple fans, have called for the inclusion of these players for years. I mean when your back is against the wall, like Branko's was this past year, what do you expect him to do? Of course he had to throw away some of his stubborness and finally listen to pure logic.
The reason for the inclusion of these players was not because of Branko, rather because of pressure by media, football experts, and ordinary fans.
By the way, how come every thread you make is supposed to point out something about Branko, and always positive? Can you even make a thread where you don't talk about Branko, or better yet, critisize him in some respect.
But time is up for this kind of stuff, we have Branko and these players for TM. Lets just support them, and get away from your agenda here which is to say, "SEE, Branko was right all along, I win you lose." I thought the call was for unity among TM fans in full support of TM, not to make childish "I told you so threads."

For your not so high IQ information, the thread is suppose to help people support Branko & TM.

[Ala]

Ala jaan, I can already see your source not being correct. Look at the list of the clubs, he never played for Bargh shiraz. He played for Fajr. Nevertheless, he might be. For some reason I had him from Shomal.


Madanchi used to play for Peyrovani who is current Fajr coach but he used to be Bargh coach before. In fact, he may return to Bargh. My only clue about Madanchi is his deep accent but I may be wrong.

.

[Ala]

Not correct Ala jaan. 3 starters have changed from Asian Cup, not two. And the subject was never about the starters but the SQUAD. The subject was re-routed by those who wish to continue seeing the "other half" empty even now. And I am sorry, the roster was NOT "decided" 1.5 years ago. It is not even decided YET!!!

here is the roster in China Game:

MIRZAPOUR Ebrahim (GK)
KAEBI Hossein (-118')
GOLMOHAMADI Yahya
REZAEI Rahman
KAMELI-MOFRAD Jalal (-118')
ALAVI Mohamad (-52') 83'
NEKOUNAM Javad
ZAREA Sattar 48'
MAHDAVIKIA Mehdi
KARIMI Ali
DAEI Ali (C)

in Korea game Rahman was repalced with Taghi-pour.
in Oman game Nosrati played for Zare

When Hashemian joined for Jordan return game, only Azizi and Kameli were different
When Zandi joined in Manama on Feb 9, 2005 the roster was full! here it is:

[21] MIRAPOUR Ebrahim (GK)
[13] KAEBI Hossein
[20] NOSRATI Mohammad
[5] REZAEI Rahman 34'
[4] GOLMOHAMMADI Yahya
[27] ZANDI Fereydoon (-62')
[6] NEKOUNAM Javad
[2] MAHDAVIKIA Mehdi
[8] KARIMI Ali
[9] HASHEMIAN Vahid (-86')
[10] DAEI Ali

[Hadi]

I do not see the changing of 11 players as a sign of Branko not being conservative.

The Asian cup squad was a very good one but I think everyone wanted to see new players tested instead of certain player (Daie, Nosrati, Zare, Mirzapor, and even Kabi, Yahya) But Branko did not do so and he just invited some IPL players only to become TM bench warmers instead of really giving them a chance.

Eventhough he has invited new faces (which is natural snce players form change rapidly) his starting 11 is more or less the same.

[Mansoor]

here is the roster in China Game:

MIRZAPOUR Ebrahim (GK)
KAEBI Hossein (-118')
GOLMOHAMADI Yahya
REZAEI Rahman
KAMELI-MOFRAD Jalal (-118')
ALAVI Mohamad (-52') 83'
NEKOUNAM Javad
ZAREA Sattar 48'
MAHDAVIKIA Mehdi
KARIMI Ali
DAEI Ali (C)

in Korea game Rahman was repalced with Taghi-pour.
in Oman game Nosrati played for Zare

That game against China was in middle of tournament and based on injuries & suspensions, the starters were changing. Zareh was not a starter at that time but rather found his way to the starting line up after so many hoopla. The starters in game one was the point of reference. Baddavi, Nosrati (who was playing in place of Yahya who was playing in place of Kavianpour in def. mid), and Enayati (who was playing in place of injured Vahedi) are the starters who have been replaced by Zareh, Zandi (who is playing in midfield to take Yahya back to defense), and Hashemian are the replacements.

[Mansoor]

I do not see the changing of 11 players as a sign of Branko not being conservative.
The Asian cup squad was a very good one but I think everyone wanted to see new players tested instead of certain player (Daie, Nosrati, Zare, Mirzapor, and even Kabi, Yahya) But Branko did not do so and he just invited some IPL players only to become TM bench warmers instead of really giving them a chance.
Eventhough he has invited new faces (which is natural snce players form change rapidly) his starting 11 is more or less the same.

Again, the topic was about the squad not starting line up, and yes his starting line up is NOT the same either.

[delbar]

That shows how stupid some are and how smart others are. There is a significant difference in smartness of some of you. There has been no changes in the TM since the asian cup. Starters are pretty much the same. Now take a look at Portugal, Holland, Argantina, and France and see how many changes there are in their starting 11. Youth and speed is the new key to success. How many 33 yo do you see.

[Ala]

That game against China was in middle of tournament and based on injuries & suspensions, the starters were changing....


i am not saying this is bad. in fact, i think its good that he has set his team so early, BUT Branko's roster will be same as Japan game in Tehran which is Branko's core team since Hashemian joined on Sept. 8 2004, over 1.5 years ago. i doubt that he'll deviate from this much, may be not at all.


http://shushtar.com/pic/tm-roster5.jpg

.

[Hajagha]

Ooh, Haji jaan, many many incorrect statements in short post. Az to bayeed bood. Any how:
a. Your numbers about the starters is not correct. Out of 11 starters in Asian Cup, 8 of them are the starters now, not 10. That is a change of 30% which is relatively similar to change of 50% in overall team(12 out of 23 staying). And should be lower for the starting line up as it is, since there are many advantages to "justified" stability.

The starters are 8 bcz he didn't have any chance to get the other 2 (Zandi and Hashemian), so it's 10 of 11 or if I wanna be more correct 11 out of 11 since Zare was on and off at the time.


b. How in the world someone with your intelligence is connecting Branko to the problem with IPL and club level. If our players such as Alavi & Kameli fail, it has NOTHING to do with Branko & TM. It has everything to do with the club training, discipline, conditioning, and players will.

But they were part of the team till very days ago. They just dropped in last call, where Branko behaved different.



RE 1. Actually, you answered yourself. Of course it is not "automatic" as we have legioners in UAE that are not here. 5 out of 6 legioners ARE from Europe & yes, but default it is true that these Eurpean based players are "by far"(key word) better than their IPL competition. The other which is Nekunam as the only one from UAE at the moment could have and should have been in Europe if not for Denizli & Ajorloo.
RE 2. The subject was refering to the past. What has happened to Zandi is afterward and relates to his current situation which will "most likely" reflect in our upcoming set of starters. He was a permanent starter for his club when invited and played for Iran during qualifiers. Your logic is using the future problem to complain about the past decision as if Branko had a magic ball to see Zandi will only play 20 minutes next year therefore we should avoid starting him even if he is a starter in top five league in the world at the moment!
RE 3. Really Haji jaan? Do you really think our IPL players in current form and current coaching and current facilities are ready for Europe (and would be there if not for technical reasons)???? Did you hear our IPL & Hazfi cup champions lost yesterday to alghorazeh & alghomeyisheh from countries below top 50 in the world and got eliminated? .... again .....

How do you know they are better? The way Daei is better than the rest since he scored 120+ goals in a decade ago? Or training with a relegated team, like Zandi? Or coming from injury like Karimi and Hashemian? Do you think Kia's place would be changed in TM if he still continued to watch his club game from home on TV? Look what they did to him with motivation. Don’t get me wrong, they are the best we have, but this doesn’t mean they should feel safe all the times.

As we say, a good rival make you stronger.

No, my friend, I think what you brought as a fact doesn't justify Branko behavior for "no competitive atmosphere".

About Saba losing in competition game, well look at their coach, you will see the rest. Pure aliasghari tactic, but this doesn't bring down the superiority of some of their players quality, however the coach was too dump to use them in a proper way.

Cheers

[Mansoor]

i am not saying this is bad. in fact, i think its good that he has set his team for such a long time, BUT Branko's roster will be same as Japan game in Tehran which is Branko's core team since Hashemian joined on Sept. 8 2004.

http://shushtar.com/pic/tm-roster4.jpg

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Ala jaan, I can't say for sure, but I believe otherwise.

[Ala]

Ala jaan, I can't say for sure, but I believe otherwise.


Mansoor Jan,

Anything otherwise will be a surprise and since Branko has talked about surprises, then I think it can happen. But, I seriously doubt it from Branko. the only positions that are not 100% is Nosrati/Zare or Zandi/Madanchi.

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[Mansoor]

The starters are 8 bcz he didn't have any chance to get the other 2 (Zandi and Hashemian), so it's 10 of 11 or if I wanna be more correct 11 out of 11 since Zare was on and off at the time.
But they were part of the team till very days ago. They just dropped in last call, where Branko behaved different.
How do you know they are better? The way Daei is better than the rest since he scored 120+ goals in a decade ago? Or training with a relegated team, like Zandi? Or coming from injury like Karimi and Hashemian? Do you think Kia's place would be changed in TM if he still continued to watch his club game from home on TV? Look what they did to him with motivation. Don’t get me wrong, they are the best we have, but this doesn’t mean they should feel safe all the times.
As we say, a good rival make you stronger.
No, my friend, I think what you brought as a fact doesn't justify Branko behavior for "no competitive atmosphere".
About Saba losing in competition game, well look at their coach, you will see the rest. Pure aliasghari tactic, but this doesn't bring down the superiority of some of their players quality, however the coach was too dump to use them in a proper way.
Cheers

Haji jaan, as a general statement I agree that the competition would bring out the best. No doubt. And I don't think if they sit home and watch TV, they'll be starters. Navidkia is not, and we shall see in case of Zandi.

Let me take this thread back to where it was supposed to be as it has been badly re-routed.

The fact is, Branko is not sold to the "same" squad as some were representing him. He does make changes, slowly, and safely, as he has since 2 years ago. There was no need for drastic and sudden changes as the team was doing good in official competitions. Since Asian cup, he has brought many into the camp to observe. That means he considers options. Now, what happens afterward is so hard to explain in public. You just can't come out and say why certain player is not starting. Who knows, he may improve (as for example Hashemian did) and statements of that nature would only ruin the relationship between the coach & player. So, he keeps it quiet and pisses people off!

On the other hand, while he could be more flexible as I was also advocating for so long, but many of those "unchanges" are out of his hands and are directly reflecting the distance between our IPL level and our team melli level. A good witness is our relevant success in Team Melli leve in Asia comparing to our IPL teams in Asia. When I bring up players one by one, I find out that there are very good reasons for their lack of playing time. Don't forget, we don't observe these players from close distance but these professionals who are highly educated in the field and use many many factors to decide, do. I had a chance to see them from close distance in practice and I found it very educational. And I am just a simple fan. Even, I could see many things that I don't see when I watch the games from long distance.

Bottom line, Branko has given chances to many players, it was them not Branko in most cases that didn't win them the job. Nevertheless, I can also argue about couple of players otherwise, but even when I brought them up, I found good reasons behind their absense. Some of these reasons are judgemental and it is their every right to use their own not mine or yours.

Mokhlesim.

[Mansoor]

Mansoor Jan,

Anything otherwise will be a surprise and since Branko has talked about surprises, then I think it can happen. But, I seriously doubt it from Branko. the only positions that are not 100% is Nosrati/Zare or Zandi/Madanchi.

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Stay tuned ;) We have good plans for Mexicans.... In fact, I believe it is perfect plan ....

[Mansoor]

That shows how stupid some are and how smart others are. There is a significant difference in smartness of some of you. There has been no changes in the TM since the asian cup. Starters are pretty much the same. Now take a look at Portugal, Holland, Argantina, and France and see how many changes there are in their starting 11. Youth and speed is the new key to success. How many 33 yo do you see.

Please comeback and visit us when you grow up.

[News-Breaker]

Of the squad for 2004 Asian Cup, only 12 players are with TM for the 2006 World Cup. That is a variation of 11 players in 2 years!
So much for Branko not giving a chance to new players & being sold to same and so on .... unless, we expect him to crack into the line up that are filled with 6 legioners ....

thx for the info..would u plz post the roster for 2004

[Ala]

... How many 33 yo do you see.


instead of attacking people, spend time to check your facts. Only Daei and Golmohammadi are over 33. In fact, we have a combination of youth, wisdom and experience and the avergae age is quite low.

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[Muradistan]

thx for the info..would u plz post the roster for 2004
ASIAN-CUP
Goalkeepers
Ebrahim Mirzapour
Hassan Roudbarian
Seyed Mahdi Rahmati
Defenders
Mehdi Amirabadi
Yahya Golmohammadi
Rahman Rezaei
Hossein Kaebi
Ebrahim Taghipour
Ali Badavi
Jalal Kameli
Mohammad Nosrati
Sattar Zare
Midfielder
Javad Nekounam
Hamed Kavianpour
Ali Karimi
Eman Mobali
Sayyed Mohammad Alavi
Farzad Majidi
Forwards
Mehdi Mahdavikia
Ali Daei
Arash Borhani
Gholamreza Enayati

WC SQUAD
Goalkeepers
Ebrahim Mirzapour
Hassan Roudbarian
Vahid Talablu
Defenders
Yahya Golmohammadi
Rahman Rezaei
Hossein Kaebi
Mohammad Nosrati
Sattar Zare
Sohrab Baktiarzideh
Amir Hosein Sadeghi
Midfielder
Javad Nekounam
Ali Karimi
Adrenak Teymourian
Javad Kazemian
Mehrzad Madanchi
Masoud Shojaei
Ferydoon Zandi
Forwards
Mehdi Mahdavikia
Ali Daei
Arash Borhani
Reza Enayati
Rasoul Khatibi
Vahid Hashemian

13 players who are on the WC Squad were also on AC squad the rest have changed, so yes Mansoor jan was right alot of changes, but also pointing out that even though alot of change has been made to the team as a whole the starting 11 remains relativley untouched.

[Hajagha]

I see no benefite to continue this debate bcz:

1, It's time to support.

2, There will be no change what so ever

3, Branko won't be with us any more to justify his acts.

All in all, his recent squad is almost all we have with may be 5% difference with the harshest changes. Sit back and enjoy the show as we may have no chance for the next time. :)

Cheers

[Ala]

I see no benefite to continue this debate bcz:
1, It's time to support.
...


exactly my thoughts

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